Dr. Chad Woolner: This episode of the laser light show is brought to you by the erroneous upcoming seminar, the mind-body connection. Revitalize your practice through neurological and traditional Chinese medicine advancements. This is going to be with my good friend, Dr. Trevor Berry, who is an amazing functional neurologist, and Dr. Dustin Tilburg, who is an incredible traditional Chinese medicine practitioner. This is going to be in Honolulu, Hawaii, of all places. So get your CES in paradise. It’s going to be amazing. It’s going to be on Saturday, September 9, and Sunday, September 10. So if you want to find out more and register for this amazing upcoming seminar, go to Erchonia.com seats are gonna go fast. You do not want to miss it. So go to Erchonia.com. Find out more, find out all the details, register, get your seat, and have an amazing time. We’ll see you guys at the seminar. What’s going on everybody? Dr. Chad Woolner here with Dr. Andrew Wells, and on today’s episode of the laser light show, we have with us Dr. Dustin Dillberg again, but this time to share a Miracle Monday story. We’re so excited to hear this story. So let’s get to it.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Growing up in Portland, Oregon, I used to love going to laser light shows at the Oregon Museum of Science and Industry. They would put on these amazing light shows with incredible designs and sync up to some of my favorite music from the Beatles to Pink Floyd to Jimi Hendrix and Metallica. They were awesome. Little did I know then that lasers would have such a profound effect on my life decades later. As a chiropractic physician, I have seen firsthand just how powerful laser therapy is at helping patients struggling with a wide range of health problems. As the leader in laser therapy, Erchonia has pioneered the field in obtaining 20 of the 23 total FDA clearances for therapeutic application of lasers. On this podcast, we’ll explore the science and technology and physiology behind what makes these tools so powerful. Join me as we explore low-level laser therapy. I’m Dr. Chad Woolner, along with my good friend, Dr. Andrew Wells, and welcome to the laser light show. All right. Welcome to the show, everybody. And welcome back. Dr. Dillberg, good to have you again. Thank you. So you have a Miracle Monday story for us. I’m excited to hear this. Because from our previous conversations, it sounds like you’ve probably got a lot of Miracle Monday stories. So this should be really, really good.
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: This is one that kind of struck me to my core, I have to admit. And it blew my mind in a way that I am excited to share. It certainly seems almost too far out there, too good to be true in some ways. So hold on to your seat. Let’s chat. So working with a woman in her late 50s, who has an interesting history, and she was deaf in one ear. And so I was thinking that might have to do with some of her postural imbalances. She’s always listening with, you know, her good side. She doesn’t remember when that one-sided deafness happened, just kind of as far back as she could remember, she could not hear well out of that side. And she was mainly presenting for frozen shoulder on the same side as her deaf ear. And through a few sessions and working with her, we got some results, especially as we started dialing in some of her postural imbalances and things like that. I was thrilled when I was able to get better range of motion in her frozen shoulder, feel that it was releasing fabulously, and she’d be thrilled with much less pain, and she walked out of my office. But without fail, whether it was a day later, two days later, a week later, she would come back with the exact same starting point. We weren’t getting anywhere in a lasting fashion. And this is kind of right when I was incorporating Erchonia lasers. And so it wasn’t necessarily that every single patient was getting lasered in the way that I practice now. And so I was choosing to go through some of the things like trying to figure out what the breaking points are, not a physical issue with her frozen shoulder, there’s got to be something deeper. Tried to ask her about her diet and all the chemical components that might cause inflammation and, you know, joint immobilization wasn’t getting anywhere with her. She, you know, I really believe she ate a really clean diet. But it seemed like there were some emotional undercurrents that might be playing a role as well. And so my dad taught me a series of forgiveness affirmations that he always gives homage to early days at any teaching him. And so I forgive myself. I forgive others. I allow others to forgive me and acknowledge your higher power and ask for forgiveness. And so I was going through this and asking her just to think of whatever’s come into mind as we start to laser this whole area now laser in her brain, her, you know, that quadrant to her shoulder and scapula. And as she, as I was lasering she kind of changed her posture and looked at me in a really odd way with just her eyes were all welled up with tears. And she wouldn’t respond to me and she started to pull away from me. And she stood up, walked straight out of my office, didn’t acknowledge anyone, and disappeared. And I didn’t know, didn’t know what I did. I was scared to death like, Did I hurt you? What were you thinking? Did I offend you? She wouldn’t return any calls I called to check up on her. It was just odd. And so about two weeks later, she called the office and said, I’d like to come in for another appointment. Now we had her scheduled for certain things. She just, you know, showed me these other appointments. She completely ghosted us. Yeah. And she said, I think I’m ready for another appointment. She came in. And she’s like, before we do any of that, I think I need more treatment like that. But I have to, I have to tell you kind of what’s going on. And she proceeded to tell me that she was made aware of a memory pattern that she definitely blocked out. She had no recollection of this. But this memory was of her father, who died when she was three years old. And she had, at just shy of three, a little chatterbox listening to everything around her. And she overheard her dad in a conversation where he was having another relationship outside of marriage with another man. And she said that news to mom and created a serious family issue. And when dad heard that her or his daughter was the one that shared this news and kind of revealed this big secret, he walked up just in anger, not towards her, but just like, how could you do this to me? He wound up and it didn’t hit her. But he wound up and she protected her ear and pulled one shoulder up. And she said, I went right back into this position. That was exactly what she looked up at me. And she basically felt like she saw her dad and me kind of an odd, like memory recall. And she protected her shoulder, got up and ran away, which is similar to what she says she remembers now. And she said, I don’t know if it’s a real memory, or if it’s a dream or what’s going on. But this is really outside my comfort zone. And I don’t know what to do with it. And I said, I’m with you completely outside my comfort zone, too. I had no idea what kind of worms were opening up here. And I’m not necessarily trained in handling this. But I’m here for you and I care and I would love to help any way I can. If you’re comfortable enough with it to start lasering and going through these forgiveness affirmations, I’d love to try it again. But if you’re not comfortable, just tell me let’s stop anywhere you need to. As we began lasering to make a longer story a little shorter. It was fascinating. And her posture started to unwind. And I was lasering over her shoulder. And at this point, really, I’d heard about it, I kind of have said that I acknowledged or believed it. I didn’t. To my real core. I didn’t believe that we held emotions in tissues this way. I didn’t think trauma and emotional, you know, issues could be imprinted into tissue this way. But as I was lasering, I saw a handprint. Literally exactly the size of an adult male’s handprint turned bright red, almost purplish on her shoulder, right where she had this frozen shoulder recurring night shoulder issue. And it was wrapped around her shoulder, and I continued to laser it. And it almost looks like a cupping mark, just like tissue being separated from these deeper layers, like there’s deep adhesions through this handprint. And as that handprint went away, her arm started to move like it hadn’t moved before. She felt like it was an absolute miracle like she couldn’t move in every direction. It gently tightened up a little bit. We ended up doing it for three or four treatments. And she started to hear things that she hadn’t heard before, and her ears started to recover. It was the most wild and indescribable treatment that I’ve ever experienced. But to see an actual imprint of a hand. I literally jumped back like four feet. I was like, Is there a ghost in here? This is crazy. And it was quite impactful for both of us. So Miracle Monday, you can get decades of deeply stored trauma to release with the power of some of these lasers.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah. Wow. Wow.
Dr. Andrew Wells: I don’t know what to say to that. I mean that truly is a miracle. That’s amazing.
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: Yeah, it was wild.
Dr. Chad Woolner: I think it’s worth noting, though, I want to make sure that we don’t gloss over an important part of this, that I think practitioners need to hear it. and myself included, right? How many of us have attempted to use lasers with patients, and patients don’t get the ultimate result that we’re hoping for or the level of the result that we’re hoping for. And then we stop there. We’re like, oh, man, well, I guess, I guess that’s that. And, and yet, one of the common denominators that I find not just with you, but with the most successful practitioners in terms of outcomes with patients, is that they’re never satisfied with, you know, what I mean, they’re, they’re always willing to just dig a little bit deeper, push a little bit further. Innovate a little bit more, you know, what I mean? Think outside the box, you know, combine and stack and, and really be, look to be a problem solver. You know what I mean? And because I think it’s only natural for practitioners to want the frequency setting, you know, that’s the first thing practitioners ask, right? If they want to know, okay, what’s the, you know, okay, so they’re listening to this right, Dr. Dillberg? And they’re like, Okay, I’ve got a patient who’s dealing with deafness, or whatever. So what frequency settings did you use? You know, because then they want to, like, plug it in? And then do that? And how many minutes was it for? And where did you do it, you know, what’s the, what’s the very linear black and white protocol that you can just give to me that I can just plug right in and press them and step away and then get the result. And I think that this is where the real artistry, we’ll call it of, of being a true healer comes into play, that I think we have to acknowledge, on some level, a certain level of intuition that you have to be willing to almost submit to, to allow yourself to, and I know this might really turn some people off who are a little bit more heavy science-minded. And I totally get that. And I don’t mean to be this way. But I almost feel like being willing to submit your own judgment and your own thinking to tapping into some higher source of wisdom, understanding knowledge, whatever you want to call that, to really kind of flow, if you will, I don’t know if that’s the right word, in terms of how you go about solving these problems with patients. Right. And I think that’s the whole point is you didn’t look this up in some manual. Okay, patient presents with, you know, bilateral deafness and frozen shoulders. So what pages that aren’t, you know what I mean? Okay, read some texts. Yeah, this came about as like a little bit of trial and error and a little bit of, again, intuition. Am I correct? In that kind of way of framing that?
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: Yeah, I have to say that I was hesitant to share a story of this magnitude, because I’m sure it’ll turn a number of people off, because of it, I would have rolled my eyes at it. If it hadn’t happened to me in a number of ways I am, you know, quite a straight edge, you know, Christian male that is, you know, doesn’t really look outside that scientific box, in some ways, that over experiences, I can’t help. But I think if it’s easier to describe it as being present, like, rather than being too logical, just be present, and be aware of what’s happening right now and be open to the process, because the process doesn’t look the same for everybody. As soon as we think a = b, you know, we tend to find out that there are exceptions to certain rules we have. We have a finite limitation to our thought process that sometimes proves to be larger than our minds. And so it’s outside of a lot of my comfort zones. It’s not my training, but miracles aren’t usually in the textbooks, you know, maybe a case study, but there isn’t a protocol for miracles, and keeping our eyes and ears and awareness open to what your patient needs at whatever time is. It’s pretty special.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah, that would be my advice to those listening, right? If you want to see more miracles in your practice, if you feel like man, all these other practitioners that are in and the thing I would say is that these miracles are happening all around us. We can’t tell you how many. I mean, we get to interview docs, but I guarantee you for every doc we interview, there are 10, if not 100 more that are happening all around us. And if you’re a practitioner, who doesn’t seem to be like I don’t see Those, I would explain exactly what you said second, what Dr.Dillberg is saying here. And, and just really making sure that you’re not satisfied if you go through and you do laser on a patient and at first or second or third time, you don’t maybe get the response that you’re hoping for. Maybe step back, open your eyes and your mind to being more present, be more willing to think outside the box and approach things in a different fashion. And I think a lot of practitioners will be pleasantly surprised as to what they experienced and what they find. Because that seems to be the common denominator amongst the doc’s that we talked to who are experiencing these types of incredible stories. So it’s a beautiful story.
Dr.Dustin Dillberg: To all the docs, I would not have started here. A new patient, it’s not where I would have totally gone in, you know, to Dr. Jerome’s ADC manual looked up hearing loss and frozen shoulder and, you know, adhesions and capsulitis. And those types of frequencies. And with the majority of people you do bat at a really high percentage, right? Yeah, might not bat 1000. But you bite bad with incredibly high percentages with these tools, especially when you stack them with other therapies. Yeah. And so a number of other frozen shoulder cases I could talk to you about that seem kind of miraculous because they resolve so well. So another one earlier this week that in one treatment, they felt 100% better. But this kind of trumps that just because of the history and the outcome, I’ve never seen a handprint come up through someone’s shoulder before. in that fashion. It was incredible.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah. Amazing. Well, thank you for sharing such a beautiful story with us, Dr. Dillberg. We really appreciate you being with us. And yeah, Dr. Andrew, any thoughts?
Dr. Andrew Wells: Yeah, if you have any more stories like that, we’d love to have you back on for another miracle Monday. And thanks. Yeah, you know, that is you share that story like the hair raises up on the back of my neck. And it also encouraged dogs to go back and listen to your recent episode on therapy stacking too, because that’s kind of your miracle Monday story kind of alludes to the fact that you’re using multiple different types of therapies to help patients and I think that’s will give providers some context for how and why you’re getting the really cool results that you’re getting.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah, absolutely.
Dr. Andrew Wells: So thank you. Thank you so much. Yeah.
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: Thank you guys.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah, you bet. Awesome. Thanks for listening, everybody. We hope that this has been inspiring for you. We hope this has been yet again another incredible miracle that you heard right here on the laser light show. So Thanks, and have an awesome day. We’ll talk to you guys on the next episode. Thanks for listening to the laser light show, be sure to subscribe and give us a review. If you’re interested in learning more about Erchonia lasers just head on over to Erchonia.com. There you’ll find a ton of useful resources including research news and links to upcoming live events, as well as the Erchonia E-community where you can access for free additional resources including advanced training and business tools. Again, thanks for listening and we will catch you on the next episode.
A graduate of Pacific College of Oriental Medicine, the Egoscue Institute, and Pettibon Spinal Technologies, Dr. Dillberg has cultivated a deep understanding of how the body functions and heals. With extensive clinical experience, he has had the privilege of working closely with elite professional athletes, enriching their lives through his holistic approach.
Dr. Dillberg’s journey has been marked by notable accomplishments. In 2014, he co-authored the book “Body and Soul” alongside the inspirational Bethany Hamilton, offering insights into the harmony of physical and spiritual well-being. Anchored on the island of Kauai, he oversees the Pain Free Kauai clinic, where he seamlessly integrates traditional Chinese medicine with postural corrective exercise, laser therapy, and functional medicine.
On today’s episode of the Laser Light Show we get to hear our distinguished guest, Dr. Dustin Dillberg, discuss his knowledge in the realms of sports medicine, myofascial systems, lymphatics, pain management, and functional medicine.
To find out more about Dr. Dillberg visit: https://www.painfree-kauai.com/
As a captivating speaker and consultant, Dr. Dillberg shares his wealth of knowledge with healthcare professionals, illuminating the path to integrating posture-based exercise and functional medicine into their practices. His dedication to enhancing lives through comprehensive healing approaches is truly remarkable
“As we began lasering to make a longer story a little shorter. It was fascinating. And her posture started to unwind. And I was lasering over her shoulder. And at this point, really, I’d heard about it, I kind of have said that I acknowledged or believed it. I didn’t. To my real core. I didn’t believe that we held emotions in tissues this way. I didn’t think trauma and emotional issues could be imprinted into tissue this way.” -Dr. Dustin Dillberg
“As soon as we think a = b, you know, we tend to find out that there are exceptions to certain rules we have. We have a finite limitation to our thought process that sometimes proves to be larger than our minds.” -Dr. Dustin Dillberg
7-Minute Read
In the realm of medical advancements, technology continues to revolutionize various aspects of healthcare, and body fat reduction is no exception. Erchonia’s Emerald laser stands out as a cutting-edge, FDA Market-Cleared technology designed to target stubborn fat and provide clients with an effective body fat loss treatment.
The non-invasive procedure presented here provides a host of unique benefits that distinguish it from alternative fat reduction approaches. Within this all-encompassing piece, we thoroughly explore the array of advantages offered by the green light wavelength low level laser technology showcased in Erchonia’s revolutionary Emerald laser.
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Related: How Men and Women Store Fat Differently
Comparing the Emerald laser to liposuction and cryolipolysis (fat freezing), we discover that it offers a non-destructive alternative. Unlike these invasive procedures, the Emerald laser does not pose the risk of damaging surrounding tissues or organs, providing an added layer of safety for patients.
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The introduction of the Emerald laser into medical and physician offices represents a pivotal augmentation to their service repertoire, differentiating them from competitors and adeptly addressing the diverse prerequisites of their patients. As technological advancement continues unabated, exploring the potential of the Emerald laser in the realm of fat loss treatments presents a panorama of prospects and elevated patient outcomes, fundamentally transforming the landscape of body fat reduction and overall well-being.
In summation, the emergence of green light wavelength low level laser technology has redefined the domain of fat reduction treatments, offering a secure, efficacious, and non-disruptive avenue for individuals aspiring to reshape their physique and amplify their self-assurance. With the Emerald laser leading this transformative journey, the future of fat reduction treatments shines brighter than ever before.
Related: How to Choose Low Level Laser Therapy Devices for Your Practice
Discover the benefits of Low-Level Laser Therapy (3LT®) by Erchonia, a world leader in the field of 3LT® technology. Learn how 3LT® can help reduce the need for prescription opioids for chronic low back pain, the science behind 3LT® and the difference between visible lasers and infrared lasers.
Dr. Chad Woolner: This episode of the laser light show is brought to you by Erchonia’s upcoming seminar, “The Mind-Body Connection: Revitalize your practice through neurological and traditional Chinese medicine advancements.” Join my good friend, Dr. Trevor Berry, an amazing functional neurologist, and Dr. Dustin Dillberg, an incredible traditional Chinese medicine practitioner, in Honolulu, Hawaii, on Saturday, September 9, and Sunday, September 10. For more details and registration, visit Erchonia.com. Seats are going fast, so don’t miss it. What’s going on, everybody? Dr. Chad Woolner here with Dr. Andrew Wells. And on today’s episode of the laser light show, we have with us a special guest, Dr. Dustin Dillberg, all the way from Hawaii. We’re excited to chat with him. Let’s get to it.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Growing up in Portland, Oregon, I used to love going to laser light shows at the Oregon Museum of Science and Industry. They would put on these amazing light shows with incredible designs synced up to some of my favorite music from the Beatles to Pink Floyd to Jimi Hendrix and Metallica. Little did I know then that lasers would have such a profound effect on my life decades later. As a chiropractic physician, I have seen firsthand just how powerful laser therapy is at helping patients struggling with a wide range of health problems. Erchonia has pioneered the field in obtaining 20 of the 23 total FDA clearances for therapeutic application of lasers. On this podcast, we’ll explore the science, technology, and physiology behind what makes these tools so powerful. Join me as we explore low-level laser therapy. I’m Dr. Chad Woolner, along with my good friend Dr. Andrew Wells, and welcome to the laser light show.
Dr. Chad Woolner: All right, welcome to the show, everyone, and welcome, Dr. Dillberg. Good to have you here with us.
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: Thank you, thrilled to be here.
Dr. Chad Woolner: So you’re coming to us from what island in Hawaii.
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: The island of Kauai. I live on the south shore in Koloa, currently have a clinic in Lihue with plans of expansion down to the South Shore also.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Fantastic. How cool is that?
Dr. Andrew Wells: Dr. Dillberg was here; he is a second-time laser light show guest. The first episode we had him on was fantastic. So we’re really happy to have you on again. And Dr. Dillberg is, correct me if I’m wrong, a doctor of Chinese medicine who grew up, I believe, in a chiropractic family if I remember that right.
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: You remember correctly; my dad’s a chiropractor and acupuncturist also.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Fantastic, fantastic, cool. What prompted you to go into Chinese medicine as opposed to chiropractic?
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: It’s kind of a funny story. I touched on it in a previous podcast as well. But I signed up for chiropractic school and was having dinner with Dr. Burrow Pet Yvonne at my family’s, my dad’s house. We sat around the table, and I was thrilled to tell him that I was on this path. And he actually said, “Take a page out of what I’ve been able to prove here and go to Chinese medical school, learn how to master that, and then come learn under me up in Gig Harbor.” And my dad’s jaw kind of dropped, and he pushed me to go to Chinese medical school first. That kind of started that path, and the rest is history.
Dr. Chad Woolner: How cool is that? That’s amazing.
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: I will also say that my first love of medicine was acupuncture after I was hit by a car when I was seven years old. And some of the trauma created a number of symptoms, including migraines, and acupuncture ended up helping me tremendously with my migraines. However, at that age, I was kind of freaking out about the whole needle thing and scared of getting the treatments even though I knew that helped. And so my dad was able to overcome my fear of needles by having me learn how to treat him. He was like, “Alright, so go ahead and poke me with a needle here, perform acupuncture on these points. See it doesn’t hurt. It’s not that crazy when you pull them out. There’s no trauma or blood or anything like that.” So he started fostering me to follow his footsteps and learn acupuncture from a really young age, and he was thrilled that I got to treat him on a pretty regular basis from a young age as well.
Dr. Chad Woolner: That’s fantastic. And how long have you been practicing for now?
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: I’ve been practicing since 2007.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Okay, so yeah, quite a while been very, very well.
Dr. Andrew Wells: Where did you go to school at?
Dr. Chad Woolner: Sorry, Andrew.
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: Pacific College of Oriental Medicine, which is now Pacific College of Health Sciences. They have three campuses, and I went to the San Diego campus.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Very cool. What were you gonna say, Andrew.
Dr. Andrew Wells: Yeah. I was gonna say the reason I’m excited about this episode, and we talked, we touched on this a little bit in our previous episode with Dr. Dillberg is that, you know, he comes from, you come from a really interesting background, and that you grew up in a chiropractic household, you knew burl, pet, Yvonne, had dinner with him. So you have that background, you went to school to learn Chinese medicine. And so I would say you bring to the table a really unique perspective on health. And I’m excited for this episode, in particular, because we’re going to be talking about how you’re integrating lots of different modalities. And I think this is important because as healthcare has kind of evolved over the last few decades, what we tend to see is hyper-specialization in certain things. Like I am the acupuncturist, I’m the chiropractor, I am a functional medicine doctor, I do this particular thing. And I find that oftentimes, hyper-specialization leads to fragmentation. And so we don’t often look at patients as a whole, you know, physical, mental, spiritual being, we kind of look at them through the eyes of a certain profession. And I’m excited for this episode because we’re going to be talking about how you’re integrating lots of different modalities to help patients with chronic health issues. And so, I’m excited for the doc’s that are listening to this because of all the people we’ve, amazing professionals and Doc’s and experts we’ve, we’ve interviewed, I think you’re one of a few that has a really such a diverse background that you have. And so yeah, so thanks again for being on.
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: Thank you, because you’ve had some of the best guests. You know, I absolutely love the show; I love listening to it because it gives you those little cues and epiphanies of Oh, that’s a great idea, I’m going to incorporate that and add it to what I’m currently doing and creating just, you know, a really amazing opportunity with learning from, you know, all of these wonderful guests that you’ve had. So thank you for including me in that group. It’s an honor.
Dr. Chad Woolner: You bet. And likewise, I would say the same thing we’ve been so lucky to be able to chat with and glean wisdom from so many brilliant dogs. I wanted to add just just in case there are people listening to this all the chiropractors when they hear the name Peda Bong, I think the vast majority of we’re going to be like oh, yeah, but for the rest of the lay public and or people who may be wondering outside the profession for all your fellow acupuncturists Chinese medicine. They’re like who’s Dr. Paragon like, this is one of the largest chiropractic techniques, systems that’s out there. If I’m not mistaken, this was to a certain extent. What is today CBP had kind of a background with I don’t know if they would say that it CBP stems from Pentagon I don’t know if that’s the correct way of putting it if they would put it that way. But I know that Dede Harrison’s dad was involved with and worked with Dr. Pentagon, is that correct?
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: From my understanding, yes, yeah. So anyway, it’s just just interesting. I have, you know, been raised under my father, and he was very active in different associations. And I love the way that he’s continued to learn for his entire career. And he graduated, shoot in the 70s, early 70s, from grad school, and just has been a lifelong learner that way. And so he you’d ask him that, and he’d give you a detailed history lesson by every aspect of it. And since I didn’t even go to true chiropractic school, I went to burls, you know, boot camp, basically. And he was in the process of starting his own chiropractic school, no relative like, we were trying to write curriculum. And that was a lot of our homework. And to kind of trade off is, it was an interesting time. That it didn’t come to fruition, but it was an amazing time that I didn’t have to have the opportunity to learn from so many other masters of different techniques. I don’t have the same level of understanding as you chiropractors do have all those other offerings.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Sure. Yeah. So let’s start here, you know, obviously utilizing Erchonia lasers as a part of this whole system and or suite will say of tools and or techniques and strategies you’re using to help patients. Let’s talk about it in terms of what is it when we talk about stacking therapies and or a multimodal approach that you’re taking? What does that look like for you what types of patients are hoping what have you found, I’m going to leave it pretty wide open for you to just go for it. And let’s start from the top and go through it, what that what that looks like and what that means to you and why?
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: What I’m yet to find something that laser hasn’t amplified or increased the value of. And so whether it’s more of a strict TCM, style practice or acupuncture style practice where we’re used to coming into a tongue and pulse diagnosis, understanding the pattern differentiation and needling our patients, maybe sending them home with herbs. There are quite a few patients that are incredibly scared of needles as I was when I was seven, you can use that laser, and that’s been well proven to change or activate the same response that a needle would have with just utilizing laser therapy, we can use different wavelengths to elicit those changes. Great study was showing that 405 nanometer wavelength over pericardium six has a wonderful effect on heart rate variability, calming the nervous system down. And so we can use laser in lieu of acupuncture needles, but I found Why would you do that when you can laser over the acupuncture needles, in my opinion works better than Eastham. It works better than Moxa by far, and I commonly describe it as a modern-day moxibustion. Instead of using those herbs that were burning that have that horrible smell that some people are allergic to or risking your burning or not only the patient but your sheets and things like that go into an acupuncture office, you’ll see Moxa effects around the office, you’re able to use more focused wavelengths with a far more scientific approach. Utilizing the frequencies and the wavelengths together to elicit a more powerful change in my opinion, then, moxibustion Max actually burns at a spectral range of 400 to roughly 1100 nanometers. And so there’s a lot of wavelengths being emitted by moxibustion, but they are not coherent, they are not focused in the way that Erchonia lasers are, that’s proven to be really important, right. And so, continuing on that TCM, type of practice, I love coffee, I love guasha. I love the way that so many massage therapists, PTs, chiropractors are also using different scraping techniques and copying these days, which are just fantastic therapeutics, but they’re so much better when you add laser. And so we can add laser, so many different places as well. I love when someone comes in, thanks to, you know, the likes of the functional neurologists and the Trevor Barry’s out there. Taking a look at posture and balance and neurological function on a really simplistic level, I do this with every one of my patients. I have adopted the Gaskey method and foundation training and a number of other like corrective exercise techniques into my clinic as well. And so before I do, most other examination, I’m always standing people up and having, you know, show me what they got what’s what’s their start position, what is the activation sequence and movement patterns that they are starting with so that we can be have a before and after testable? evaluation or or analysis. And it blows me away how effective laser is for posture correction, with very little intervention, without doing a lot of hands-on techniques without doing other things, you know, mobilizations or adjustments or corrective exercise if we laser over their cerebellum, and we laser over their low back if they have an incredibly elevated or twisted pelvis, especially with that GVL. I didn’t notice this prior to the use of the GVL. To be honest, I wasn’t looking for it. But since activating that new laser Erchonia, GVL on the spinal column, and having them do something simple like setting, pelvic tilts, or getting getting them on the pedal on wobble chair, and lasering them and standing them up and just doing before and after your valuation, groundbreaking changes occur in like two minutes. It’s radical. And so that’s just another way that any practitioner that I mentioned, chiropractor, acupuncturist massage therapists, PT anyone could elicit a pretty powerful change in their patient just by utilizing the laser on the cerebellum, parts of their brain that might be affected, and their spinal cord.
Dr. Chad Woolner: So when you’re, so you’re, I want to just tease that out real quick. Obviously being a chiropractor, when you’re having them do let’s say wobble chair or for those who don’t have wobble chair, I know tons of chiropractors who use like wobble discs right, they’ll have to sit on the discs and do that. Are you lasering the cerebellum Are you lasering the spine what and where are you lasering and or what types of settings for dogs? Because I guarantee you there are chiropractors and or rehab specialists that are like, what are the specifics that you do? I’m sure they would love to hear that.
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: I love that question and keep asking in each instance, please. So when I first noticed that I actually didn’t even start using the wobble chair, I would have them sitting on my table, and just to do some upregulation on their spinal cord. And so after noticing how powerful some of the changes are, I’ve somewhat honed in on this type of protocol where focusing on the cerebellum, ideally decided that they needed the most cervical spine. And then especially when we’re dealing with pelvic and hip elevation, rotation, tilt disparities, things like that, I’m going to be focusing on the lumbar spine. And during that time, I have them just activate the areas that they have the greatest imbalances with, and so flexion extension of their cervical spine, how to do some shoulder rolls or scapular motions, and then have them do forward and back, just pelvic tilts. And this is just sitting on the table, no wobble chair, anything else needed. And so I encourage all of you practitioners, try this, just go through about two minutes on each one of those areas, five minutes total is certainly enough, and have them stand back up and just do another posture evaluation. prior to doing any other treatments, see what happens. I think it’s a quick and easy way to show the efficacy of the laser and what it’s actually doing for our patients.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Wow. In terms of frequency settings, just pretty much like an upregulation type setting, or what’s that look like?
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: I typically do up regulation. However, I have been using the Fairbury. Brain settings, the 110 4060. Okay, on these types of patients with great success as well. Fantastic. And so that’s that’s definitely one of my favorites. Very,
Dr. Chad Woolner: Very cool. Wonderful.
Dr. Andrew Wells: Yeah, I wouldn’t. I wouldn’t think that, that I understand the, I think the rationale of why you’re doing what you’re doing, but you’re getting postural changes without really touching the patient. That is that I am correct in saying that.
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: That’s what made my jaw drop. Because I, the way that I found this out wasn’t that I was challenging it or trying to prove a point or I wasn’t looking for it. It happened to be a second guessing my like, I wasn’t looking at my notes, I was just working with a patient, I was like before you lay down, stand back up, let me see where your hips are, again, because I remember them being incredibly rotated. And I just wanted to make sure that I was having that second assessment. Everything looked so much more neutral, that I had to go back and look at my notes and check in with the patient. And then I started doing this on a regular basis with each patient. Before I start putting my hands on you, let’s go ahead, and take a look. And so during that those five minutes, and I have been going through some just basic activation, that’s where I ended up checking in with my patient and doing a lot more of the intake of asking them how they’re sleeping, what you know what their digestion is like and, and figuring out the bigger picture. But I quickly have them come in, let’s look at your posture. That’s how you sit down. I’m gonna start this process as we connect in and figure out where we’re going next.
Dr. Andrew Wells: I am 100% going to be doing that tonight with my family. My my wife, unfortunately, has scoliosis. And she’s done really well through, you know, chiropractic care, you know, using a lot of the pet IBAN techniques that I’ve learned over the years, but I’m going to do that tonight. I’m really curious like I have my laser in hand as we’re recording this. I’m going to try this tonight. So thanks for thanks for the suggestion. I’ll let you know how it goes.
Dr. Chad Woolner: You know the things that I would do, I would connect some dots for those listening. You know, we have this is obviously not a CBP podcast nor am I a CBP practitioner. But that being said, we have a lot of a debt of gratitude to CBP similar to Erchonia and that they have really pioneered a lot of groundbreaking research. Specifically I think they just published a paper showing a very clear connection between alterations in cervical posture and the autonomic nervous system function showing that even just slight subtle deviations in in head carriage and or cervical posture can create it can have an end and and this isn’t the first of its kind either. There have been several other studies that have shown things like alterations in head carriage can reduce lung capacity and breathing and or sympathetic tone, and a variety of other things. And so for those who are listening cuz because you might have some you know, we have practitioners and patients who listen to this podcast. I want them to not get lost in the so what you know what I mean? So what if one hip higher or heads tilted a little bit or shoulder sits? Posture is not that big of a deal, right? Or what does that mean? Maybe on that end, but maybe some are just like so. But what does that mean? Like, why are we doing that? Right? And, and the thing one could argue as chiropractors we’ve argued this, obviously, clearly, CBP argues this, you know, the postures a window into not only the spine, but now clearly showing the health of the autonomic nervous system and the overall nervous system, right. And so what we’re talking about here, might appear at kind of surface level, like, okay, that’s kind of cool. But what we’re talking about in terms of global health is far more significant than than people might realize.
Dr. Dustin Dillberg:
You know, it certainly isn’t. And, you know, from the Peter Gasby, are you familiar with Egoscue method? I’m not interesting. nonmedical posture, corrective exercise method. He is a veteran who took Piatigorsky, the originator of the method to trapnell, and was basically told that he was going to have one hell of a future not being able to live the life that he wanted. And he found himself in that point of despair, I got to figure this stuff out myself, he found himself at a library looking at anatomy books, trying to figure out, that’s what anatomy is supposed to look like, and look at mine, it’s not lined up that way at all, I’ve got serious issues, what can I do to stimulate my body to correct itself. And he is just posture, like focused, the only thing that matters kind of a guy. And I’ve seen that method work wonders in many different settings, working in his clinic, working with my own patients, and teaching the method to a number of other therapists. Posture gives us a window into why one side develops arthritis faster than the other, why one joint is compromised, and usually making up for a dysfunction or an instability elsewhere. It’s doing more work than it’s designed to do. And it’s not, you know, adding those shearing stresses in a properly distributed way. We end up irritating the body in a way that it’s not designed to be irritated. And so it’s really quick or simple for me to want to pause where you, you jumped into, of course, the amazing autonomic nervous system component. And you took more complex perspective than I think it’s even as quick as we can back up and just be like, well, one hip’s out here, think about the shearing forces on that knee, ankle, and upstream also, right, your cross crawl and gait pattern. If you go on that 5k Run, which is a healthy, wonderful activity. It’s not as healthy as it could be if you were balanced in running.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah, yeah, that makes sense. It’s interesting. As a practitioner, you know, early on in practice, when I was a young new, wet behind the ears practitioner, I had a patient challenged me on I had shown this patient some degenerative changes that were taking place, and he was highly skeptical to begin with of me and or chiropractic all together. And he challenged me he’s like, Well, isn’t, isn’t some level of, you know, arthritis and or deterioration to be expected with aging? And I was like, Well, yes. But you know, and that’s all he needed, you know, the wiggle room there for him to like, immediately. And I had a much more seasoned practitioner kind of, you know, take me under his wing, so to speak, they’re there. And he basically posed a simple, logical question. He said, you know, whether we’re dealing with a knee joint, a hip joint, or a spinal joint, he said, are they all the same age? Yeah. So if aging was the only answer, yeah, it would be purely uniform everywhere, right. And occasionally, we do see some uniform wear and tear. Again, it varies from patient to patient, obviously, right. So that, you know, you have to factor in a whole lot there. That opens up a lot of different considerations as well. But the point being is exactly what you said. You can’t ignore the very clear biological implications and or just mechanisms behind what is self evident in terms of driving a lot of these issues. Number one, that was the first thing I wanted to say. Second thing was, it never ceases to amaze me on this podcast. How many things we learn in terms of this posture correction method that I’ve never once heard in my life and yet no doubt is probably changing the lives of countless people all across the world, is my guess, you know, and, you know, I can’t help but think of the old adage that cliche you know, necessity is the mother of envy. Incheon, you know, so many of these systems and techniques and strategies develop as a result of just people, just everyday people ambitiously seeking answers and or looking for solutions, right? I read that book a couple years back by James Nester called breath. And he was talking about how there’s a guy in Eastern Europe, I’m gonna, you’re gonna have to look at the book to get the actual reference. I can’t remember the guys name. But he was correcting scoliosis or so they claimed, I mean, it seemed to have some validity to it purely with using breathwork in conjunction with like postural position holds and things like that, and was helping people in substantial ways. And so you just, I, it’s never going to cease to amaze me with all the guests that we have the body of knowledge, I think a Patient and practitioner would get a fantastic education. By listening to these episodes, like you said, you know, we get so great we get to we get to survey all these different experts, and learn about these things we had on a doc who does golfing and I knew very little about golfing until we we talked to this doc, we met him down at the Erchonia event in Orlando over a year ago, or almost a year ago at this point. And just incredible. So, so cool to hear these things that I’ve just never been exposed to. So thank you for enlightening us and sharing these insights.
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: My pleasure. Yeah, and it’s so incredible as we just brought up posture by itself, but all the things that contribute to a postural abnormality. It’s not just because you’re a golfer, it’s right-handed, and you swing it only in one direction. But it goes back to, you know, every aspect of our life and chemical and emotional imbalances. And, like, We’re such a, you know, a single entity that is affected by our entire, you know, phenotype and surroundings. And it’s, it’s really impactful to think of what is that emotion doing to our posture, we can see, when someone’s sad, we can see something when someone’s excited, it changes your posture, it activates different muscles, we can see it in the face, we can see it and the overall head to toe posture. And so, yeah, just, there’s probably a number of bunny trails that I’m pausing right now instead of going down. But it certainly does change your outlook when your body has made alignment, we feel different. Absolutely. And actually, we did a really interesting little workshop, I love working with a nonprofit organization called beautifully flawed. It was formerly named The Friends of Bethany Hamilton foundation, but it’s renamed as beatlesque sloth. And we work with those that have limb difference and limb loss, which is a really cool demographic to get to work with as you as chiropractors. Now, once you have one quadrant, whether it’s upper limb or lower limb not firing the same way as the opposite side, you start to develop certain things like scoliosis, because you don’t have the same firing pattern, pulling it all angles of the spine any longer. And so most of them either have scoliosis, or are developing it quite quickly, and putting them into a series of breathwork and postural exercises. And before we did that, we had them go into just a real light, simplistic breathing meditation and to address their biggest fears to go into the deepest, darkest area of their brain, the thing that would just give them chicken skin, or make them feel awful. And just go think of that memory, think of what’s happening and give it a color, give, you know, really assess how it makes you feel. And then we did these exercises through breath work and, and posture correction, and then had them go back into that same memory and thought pattern. And without fail. People were saying, wow, it made me feel insecure and gross and kind of sick to my stomach. It looked dark, just you know, dark black, Gray’s purples, and afterwards, it didn’t really bother me. I kind of smiled at that thought it didn’t affect me the same way. Our ability to adapt to our surroundings change drastically when you breathe right and your system is in the right position to be able to conquer or take on whatever is going to come up and hit you with whatever type of stress it might be. So that’s a really cool experience that we try to do with these amputees.
Dr. Chad Woolner: No doubt. I’m curious, have you done that exercise while stacking lasers in conjunction with that in terms of breathing and visualization and all that?
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: Absolutely. That’s actually one of my favorite things to do. Which again will cross over to any type of user of lasers at home or in clinic is visualization. And with pain, just as an example, had a gentleman who loved his outdoor life loved surfing and biking and playing and he kept on having a certain reoccurrence of pain. So what ended up really changing or tipping the scale in his favor and allowed for his body to hold the changes that he was able to feel in other methods or treatment was actually checking in and visualizing just something as simple as laying down imaginarily laying down on a surfboard and paddling which would light up his back. So he knew he couldn’t do it. And so he couldn’t imagine doing that without pain. If you can’t imagine doing something without pain, it’s gonna be really hard to actually do it with. So I had him just sitting on the table and said, I want you to stand up and walk to my front door, just in your mind and walk back and I was lasering him. And he said, All right. Well, I felt my back. As I started to stand up, I hesitated for a second I felt the jolt right. When I always feel the jolt one day load on my right leg, I took a step. And I felt it again had to kind of breathe and reset. And then I could walk with a decreased level of pain, which is the exact pattern that he has every single time he stood up for years and years, and walk back sat down, and he felt it as his hips hit the table. But this is all just through visualization. He hadn’t gotten off the table, he was sitting there the entire time, it took him about seven times of visualizing it, trying to imagine it not hurting before he was able to walk through that exercise without imagining that pain, or feeling that pain. And as he was able to break through with that visualization, his pain started to change quickly. And so stacking visualization is a powerful tool that I use in my practice with all of the other tools laser included, but also with the needles, guided imagery walking you into the area of your body that is inflamed or diseased and imagining that being you know, capable of healing, proper blood flow, proper oxygenation of your tissues, all of those things.
Dr. Chad Woolner: I want to dig into that for just a minute for those listening, because there might be some who are inherently skeptical and fair enough. Totally understand that. Where that could sound almost like quasi hocus pocus for some people like visualizations and butterflies. I was there this Yeah, totally. However, the thing that was interesting is I want to connect some really important dots. We just did an episode prior with Dr. David George. And he was an Dr. schmoe and Dr. George was talking about this very thing and the term he used is priming with patients who are dealing with chronic pain. And a lot of it was exactly what you’re saying, stacking or combining lasers with various types of it almost would have and maybe I’m totally doing this wrong by him or whatnot, but it almost has like some sort of a parallel and overlap with like cognitive behavioral therapy, and or similar types of emotional or counseling based therapies where you’re having patients go through these mental and or emotional exercises, which are and the thing that I would say to those people who might potentially be dismissive of this or skeptical of these sorts of things. Understand that these visualizations, these emotional based exercises, mental and or emotional and or cognitive things together, you’re firing pathways. That’s not. That’s not like, that’s not imaginary. There’s literal neurological pathways that are firing there when you’re doing that. And so this whole idea of, of utilizing those types of mental and or emotional exercises, cognitive exercise, whatever you want to call that visualizations, stacked with lasers is something I think personally, and I don’t think I’m alone here that is like really on the cutting edge of some pretty advanced types of strategies for people who are dealing with chronic pain and or probably even phobias and or anxieties, PTSD and or a variety of those things, no doubt I’m making a massive impact, I’m sure you can speak to that, from your experience working with patients. And obviously, having done this this very thing,
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: Well think about the power of our thoughts. Just thinking about something elicits a very real change. If you think about something that’s scary, are heart rate changes, you can be watching a movie in the comfort of your own home, you know, no one’s in your closet jumping out with an axe, you see that on the screen, and you jump your heart rate, you know, completely shifts, or an example that I like to give this much more calm and enjoyable, is, if you were to really visualize yourself, picking a lemon off of a tree, cutting a wedge out of that lemon, put it in your mouth and chopping down and tasting that lemon. Knowing that you aren’t really doing it. Most people will actually feel like they’re salivary glands start to pucker up and start to produce, you know, enzymes and saliva to break down this lemon that you’re not even chewing on. So if you think about something, your body doesn’t necessarily differentiate that from reality, it starts to respond to it as if it were as real as anything. So our thoughts of pain certainly elicit a certain number of chemical changes, physical changes. And it does it on a conscious and unconscious level. I think, kind of rolling that into another aspect of balance that you started to touch on with the posture is if someone is standing and they have decent balance, you haven’t closed their eyes and they’re about to fall over. Subconsciously, their body is going to be holding on to an immense amount of tension. Whether that’s at their feet and gripping for hammer toes, or you know, their hips are a lot tighter, the hamstrings are tighter, there’s more shear and wear and tear in their movement patterns. Because the increased tension, then would be optimal. If we’re able to recalibrate their bodies, proprioception through some of the cerebellum lasering. In conjunction with all the other awesome stuff, if you’re doing body work and stretching for their hamstrings, or you’re doing acupuncture needling for their urinary bladder and gallbladder meridians, you’re going to get an awesome change there. But you’re also going to allow for it to change to have a longer term shift, because you’re reconnecting that neurological function and putting them back into a greater state of balance. And it is very consistent that you can, upon Balanced Testing, take someone through something and they’ll have a pretty good shift in one treatment if you’re lucky. But after three or four treatments, they’re coming in with great balance versus when you compare it to the first visit. So it doesn’t always happen all in that first day or week. But by the third or fourth, they’re showing up at your office and you’re definitely dealing with a very different situation than you started with. Which I think just is kind of that key that unlocks the healing potential for so many different syndromes, symptoms, diseases.
Dr. Chad Woolner: I’m hoping that for practitioners who are listening, I really truly and I think this will be the case that as they’re listening various ideas and or thoughts are popping up in their head in terms of strategies and or ways that they can enhance. And I think what’s cool about what you’re sharing here is these are very universal principles and ideas and or ideas for application right, whether you’re a chiropractor, medical doctor, osteopath, acupuncturist, nurse practitioner, you know, what you’re sharing here are fairly universal concepts and ideas that I hope are like, as wherever the practitioner is that they’re listening to this, whether they’re driving or whatnot, that I’m hoping light bulbs are going off, where they’re like, oh, yeah, that’s a really powerful insight and a way that we can apply lasers in helping our patients. We’re going to say, Andrew,
Dr. Andrew Wells: I wasn’t gonna say anything. Maybe I had that look on my face. I do. I do have a thought though. If Doc’s are listening to this, and let’s say they have a laser already, and this makes sense to them, what would be a doctor Dilbert? What would be your recommendation to them for maybe experimenting with what you’re talking about or adopting some of the things you’re talking about? Where do you, where do you even start?
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: Great question. Keep it simple. Whatever you’re doing even if you don’t have a lot of experience with lasers or any other modality period, you can still find a certain level of success for for most people if you keep it simple, and you use frequencies such as the upregulation or general pain setting, and you laser different areas and just try to think about what makes sense for you. In terms of other learning opportunities, I think this podcast and all the episodes you’ve done, do exactly with what you’re saying, Dr. Chad is that it sparks ideas and makes you think even if it wasn’t said on the podcast, it’s going to spur you on to finding some really cool techniques or ideas or, or methods to utilize the laser. I love the the process or opportunity to share I’m going to be teaching with Dr. Trevor Berry and a wahoo in Honolulu, September 9, and 10th, we have a really fun seminar that we’re going to put together and I in person, I love sharing protocols that come from acupuncture and Chinese medicine for things that are really common. We talked about scoliosis, or neck pain, low back pain, they’re in a sequence of acupuncture points that we know have powerful neurological responses that we can teach you where and how to stimulate acupuncture points with the laser. And so great for acupuncturists is great for chiropractors, it’s great for anyone. And so I’m also going to be speaking at the Pacific Symposium on this topic as a large gathering of acupuncture and Chinese medicine practitioners in San Diego, the first few days of November. And so at the Pacific symposium, I’ll be there as well. And there, Tony is going to have a booth there, a great opportunity to think about lasers in kind of a different setting. But think of just overlapping any modality with lasers, and I’ve seen it work too well to deny, like, why not have the one plus one equals four type of synergistic effect of everything you’re doing including chemistry, I don’t know, if you guys have played around with supplementation, and lasers or biology and lasers, we’re finding that certain nutrients seem to be light activated. There’s some interesting research showing that turmeric and curcuminoids actually can have different responses when light is shown. So if you have a biological available store of active Turmeric compounds to Merlin’s and curcuminoids and you then laser over an inflamed joint, we may be able to activate that area. I’ve heard similar research referring to CBD. And I would imagine that so many other plant compounds and herbs and nutrients may have a similar response. We know that red blood cells and anything with mitochondria have those types of responses, I am interested or eager to see what happens when we find these other anti inflammatory or healing compounds. What they have to do when we stack those, we have a tissue that’s saturated with glutathione or, you know, herbs, and then we shine a light on where it needs to go to work.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah, wow. Yeah, that opens up a whole new kind of realm of possibilities, right in terms of if I’m understanding what you’re saying is utilizing these lasers as almost, we’ll call it a bat signal. That’s what we’ll call it a bat signal to deploy the Batman supplements to the respective area that they are required to help with.
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: I have certainly noticed if you are testing Omega index, those patients that have a higher omega three index respond to laser therapy faster and more profoundly than those that are in the dumps. Interesting.
Dr. Chad Woolner: That’s another good little nugget for practitioners and what an easy test to write. Low cost, super easy finger prick test any practitioner can do that just about and in terms of fixing any of those imbalances again, relatively easy, you know, in terms of that, so brilliant, brilliant. Dr. Tilbury this has been absolutely phenomenal. And we really do appreciate you sharing some really profound insights with us today on this episode. Andrew, did you have any final thoughts in wrapping up?
Dr. Andrew Wells: I’m just hoping that Erchonia will send us to Hawaii so we can sit down with Dr. Dilbert and just like hammer out like 10 episodes in a row. Yeah.
Dr. Chad Woolner: I like that too. Yeah, y’all read idea okay, we’re telling Erchonia we need we need to do a series of these on location we can no longer do these so I like that idea. Fantastic.
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: How waterproof is your equipment?
Dr. Chad Woolner: We can make it waterproof if board meeting ah there we go. Yeah, we’ll we’ll figure it out. Yeah, there you go. Fantastic meetings
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: All surfboards always go better.
Dr. Chad Woolner: There you go. Awesome, Docs. We hope those listening docks and non docks alike. We hope those listening have really enjoyed this episode. This This has been a really fun one. And we appreciate Dr. Dillberg being here with us and sharing his experience and his wisdom. And we know that this is going to help a lot of practitioners and in turn a lot of patients so thank you so much Dr. Dillberg, for your time and for your expertise.
Dr. Dustin Dillberg: It’s my pleasure. Thank you guys.
Dr. Chad Woolner: You bet. All right, everybody have an amazing day. We’ll talk to you guys on the next episode. Thanks for listening to the laser light show, be sure to subscribe and give us a review. If you’re interested in learning more about Erchonia lasers just head on over to Erchonia.com. There you’ll find a ton of useful resources including research news and links to upcoming live events, as well at Erchonia E community where you can access for free additional resources including advanced training and business tools. Again, thanks for listening and we will catch you on the next episode.
A graduate of Pacific College of Oriental Medicine, the Egoscue Institute, and Pettibon Spinal Technologies, Dr. Dillberg has cultivated a deep understanding of how the body functions and heals. With extensive clinical experience, he has had the privilege of working closely with elite professional athletes, enriching their lives through his holistic approach.
Dr. Dillberg’s journey has been marked by notable accomplishments. In 2014, he co-authored the book “Body and Soul” alongside the inspirational Bethany Hamilton, offering insights into the harmony of physical and spiritual well-being. Anchored on the island of Kauai, he oversees the Pain Free Kauai clinic, where he seamlessly integrates traditional Chinese medicine with postural corrective exercise, laser therapy, and functional medicine.
On today’s episode of the Laser Light Show we get to interview our distinguished guest, Dr. Dustin Dillberg. A speaker, writer, and educator, Dr. Dillberg is a beacon of knowledge in the realms of sports medicine, myofascial systems, lymphatics, pain management, and functional medicine.
Tune in to the “Laser Light Show Podcast” as Dr. Dustin Dillberg uncovers the science and applications of low-level laser therapy, shedding light on its potential to revolutionize the landscape of health and wellness. His insights and expertise will undoubtedly captivate and inspire, making this episode an invaluable resource for all those intrigued by the magic of healing light.
To find our more about Dr. Dillberg visit: https://www.painfree-kauai.com/
As a captivating speaker and consultant, Dr. Dillberg shares his wealth of knowledge with healthcare professionals, illuminating the path to integrating posture-based exercise and functional medicine into their practices. His dedication to enhancing lives through comprehensive healing approaches is truly remarkable
“Great study was showing that a 405 nanometer wavelength over pericardium six has a wonderful effect on heart rate variability, calming the nervous system down. And so we can use lasers in lieu of acupuncture needles, but I found Why would you do that when you can laser over the acupuncture needles…you’re able to use more focused wavelengths with a far more scientific approach. Utilizing the frequencies and the wavelengths together to elicit a more powerful change.” -Dr. Dillberg
“Whatever you’re doing even if you don’t have a lot of experience with lasers or any other modality period, you can still find a certain level of success for for most people if you keep it simple, and you use frequencies such as the upregulation or general pain setting, and you laser different areas and just try to think about what makes sense for you.” -Dr. Dillberg
“But since activating that new laser Erchonia, GVL on the spinal column, and having them do something simple like setting, pelvic tilts, or getting getting them on the pedal on wobble chair, and lasering them and standing them up and just doing before and after your valuation, groundbreaking changes occur in like two minutes. It’s radical.” -Dr. Dillberg
8-Minute Read
Low-Level Laser Therapy (LLLT) is gaining popularity in medical practices due to its non-invasive nature and potential therapeutic benefits. These devices utilize low-intensity lasers or light-emitting diodes to stimulate cellular function and promote healing. If you’re considering incorporating LLLT into your practice, it’s crucial to choose the right device to ensure optimal treatment outcomes.
In this article, we will explore the types of low-level laser therapy devices available and provide guidance on selecting the most suitable device for your practice.
LLLT devices are available in both handheld and stationary forms, offering flexibility for targeted treatment on specific areas with handheld devices, while stationary devices are designed for larger treatment areas or multiple patients at once.
When it comes to LLLT devices, there are several important distinctions to consider. Understanding these differences will help you make an informed decision.
Related Reading: Laser Classification
Before choosing an LLLT device for your practice, it is essential to carefully assess several factors:
To find the ideal device, you should prioritize selecting the one that best meets the specific needs of your patients. By doing so, you can provide the most efficient and effective care, which fosters trust and encourages them to return for future needed treatments.
Related: Comparing Cost of LLLT to other Treatments
Choose devices with customizable treatment protocols, allowing personalized adjustments to cater to individual patient needs and diverse medical conditions.
To achieve smooth integration of the LLLT device into your practice, consider the following user-friendliness and compatibility aspects:
For a smooth integration of the LLLT device into your practice, it’s important to prioritize comprehensive technical support and training. Make sure to check if the manufacturer provides robust technical support, addressing any device-related issues promptly.
To ensure seamless integration of the LLLT device into your practice, prioritize comprehensive technical support and training, and verify if the manufacturer offers prompt resolution of any device-related issues.
In addition, consider looking for training opportunities provided by the manufacturer to ensure you and your staff can operate the LLLT device effectively. By taking these factors into account, you’ll be well-informed to make the best decision and choose the LLLT device that suits your practice’s needs, ensuring optimal care for your patients.
Different LLLT devices have varying therapeutic applications and effectiveness. Consider the specific treatments you plan to offer in your practice and choose a device that aligns with those needs.
Introducing Erchonia’s Emerald Laser, an FDA Market-Cleared full-body fat loss treatment targeting stubborn fat areas with cold laser technology, treating overall body circumference and approved for clients with a BMI up to 40.
For example, Erchonia offers a range of LLLT devices for various applications, including:
At Erchonia, we take pride in offering a wide range of LLLT devices with unique features and applications, making us a reputable provider to consider. If you want to learn more about our products and find the most suitable LLLT device for your practice, don’t hesitate to reach out to us for further information. We’re here to assist you in making an informed decision and ensuring seamless integration of our LLLT device into your practice, ultimately delivering optimal care to your patients.
Discover the benefits of Low-Level Laser Therapy (3LT®) by Erchonia, a world leader in the field of 3LT® technology. Learn how 3LT® can help reduce the need for prescription opioids for chronic low back pain, the science behind 3LT® and the difference between visible lasers and infrared lasers.
Related: LLLT Safety: Guidelines for Minimizing Risks and Side Effects
6-Minute Read
Low level light therapy (LLLT), renowned for its non-invasive approach and potential therapeutic benefits, has garnered substantial popularity as a treatment option for a diverse array of conditions.
However, as the use of LLLT continues to increase, it is paramount to prioritize laser safety and minimize potential risks and side effects associated with this form of therapy. Laser safety guidelines play a vital role in ensuring the well-being of both practitioners and patients. By implementing the following key laser safety guidelines, healthcare professionals can provide LLLT treatments with confidence and minimize potential risks.
In this article we’ll discuss some best practices when it comes to LLLT safety including how to implement these key tips:
Each of these three essential best practices serves as a foundation, with numerous underlying aspects that are worth exploring. Let’s delve into the fundamentals and explore guidelines that can promote the seamless and secure implementation of this new technology.
The U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) is responsible for regulating medical devices, including lasers, to ensure their safety and effectiveness. It is important to use laser devices that meet FDA safety standards, as this will help minimize risks and potential side effects such as burns or eye damage. Healthcare professionals should be familiar with FDA regulations and take the necessary steps to ensure that their laser devices meet all safety requirements.
Here are the key fundamentals to be aware of:
Practitioners and medical offices utilizing LLLT must prioritize and strictly adhere to standard FDA requirements and guidelines. A crucial aspect is minimizing unnecessary laser exposure through the use of suitable protective equipment and adherence to institutional safety protocols. Let’s now explore the topic of laser exposure safety in greater depth.
Related Reading: How Men and Women Store Fat Differently
LLLT can be effective in treating a wide variety of conditions, however it is important to remember that laser exposure may also carry risks. It is essential for practitioners and patients alike to practice safety procedures and limit unnecessary laser exposure during treatment sessions.
Healthcare professionals should be aware of the potential risks associated with LLLT including:
To minimize potential side effects, healthcare providers should consistently wear protective eyewear during treatments and strictly adhere to institutional safety protocols when operating laser devices. Patients should also be provided with appropriate eye protection during any LLLT session.
Related: Cold Laser Therapy for Neck & Shoulder Pain
Moreover, ensuring adequate airflow in the treatment area is essential to avoid excessive accumulation of heat and reduce the potential for tissue harm.
Practitioners should prioritize educating themselves and others about laser safety guidelines and remain updated on any changes or new regulations concerning LLLT. Acquiring knowledge about laser hazards is vital for mitigating risks and staying well-informed. This proactive approach ensures practitioners are well-prepared to handle laser-related challenges effectively.
Ensuring the safety of your patients and promoting awareness about laser hazards is essential in a medical office utilizing LLLT.
Here are valuable strategies to educate patients and the public on LLLT safety:
Related Reading: How to Market Laser Therapy
Through the implementation of these strategies, organizations can proactively promote the safety of Low-Level Laser Therapy (LLLT) and enhance awareness among patients and the general public regarding its advantages and precautions. By fostering a solid foundation of knowledge and emphasizing strict adherence to safety protocols, organizations can cultivate an environment that prioritizes safety and maximizes the effectiveness of LLLT practices, resulting in a more secure and successful implementation of this therapeutic approach.
With a strong foundation of knowledge and a commitment to safety, LLLT can be effectively and securely integrated into medical practices, providing patients with a safer therapeutic experience.
Discover the benefits of Low-Level Laser Therapy (3LT®) by Erchonia, a world leader in the field of 3LT® technology. Learn how 3LT® can help reduce the need for prescription opioids for chronic low back pain, the science behind 3LT® and the difference between visible lasers and infrared lasers.
Related: Comparing Cost of LLLT to other Treatments
Dr. Chad Woolner: This episode of the laser light show is brought to you by belfortlifestyle.com. It’s a really innovative concept on fitness developed by Vitor Belfort. To learn more about his gyms or potentially owning one, go to belfortlifestyle.com. Vitor Belfort is an incredibly inspiring individual who has also developed a nonprofit organization, Together for Them, designed to help fight against human and sex trafficking. Vitor’s sister went missing in 2004, which initiated his involvement in this cause. To learn more, go to together4them.org and find out the amazing things Vitor and his family are doing. We hope you enjoy this interview; it was amazing. What’s going on everybody, Dr. Chad Woolner here with Dr. Andrew Wells, and on today’s episode of the laser light show, we have with us a special guest Vitor Belfort, the MMA legend. So, we’re super excited to get to chat with him. We appreciate him taking time out of his schedule to be here with us. So let’s get to it.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Growing up in Portland, Oregon, I used to love going to laser light shows at the Oregon Museum of Science and Industry. They would put on these amazing light shows with incredible designs synced up to some of my favorite music from the Beatles to Pink Floyd to Jimi Hendrix and Metallica. They were awesome. Little did I know then that lasers would have such a profound effect on my life decades later. As a chiropractic physician, I have seen firsthand just how powerful laser therapy is at helping patients struggling with a wide range of health problems. As the leader in laser therapy, Erchonia has pioneered the field in obtaining 20 of the 23 total FDA clearances for therapeutic application of lasers. On this podcast, we’ll explore the science, technology, and physiology behind what makes these tools so powerful. Join me as we explore low-level laser therapy. I’m Dr. Chad Woolner, along with my good friend Dr. Andrew Wells, and welcome to the laser light show. All right, welcome to the show, everybody, and a huge welcome to Vitor. Vitor, thank you so much for being here with us. We appreciate it.
Vitor Belfort: It’s a pleasure. It’s a joy to be very excited so we can laser talk.
Dr. Chad Woolner: I’m excited about this personally. When Erchonia let us know that they were chatting with you and working with you and your son, I kinda gotta admit, I geeked out a little bit. I’ve been a huge fan of yours for a number of years. You’ve had an incredible career with UFC and MMA. And let me see if I have this correctly. Your a Carlson Gracie black belt, is that correct?
Vitor Belfort: Yes.
Dr. Chad Woolner: In Brazilian jiu-jitsu. So for those who are familiar with Brazilian jiu-jitsu, like in terms of lineage that’s like top of the heap in terms of Carlson, Hickson, Hélio, and all those names there, you’re at the top of the pile there, so that’s incredible. First off and so yeah, absolutely. And what years again did your career span in UFC? It was like mid-2000s.
Vitor Belfort: No, I started in 1996.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Okay.
Vitor Belfort: So yeah, it was when it was a tournament.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Okay.
Vitor Belfort: You have to win the tournament to become a champion, and they came up with the Super fights. So they had the super fights where the guy who won the tournament goes and fights the super fights, so that’s where the title came. So you would win the tournament, you get the model, and they started creating those super fights that today are the title fights. So it was right in the beginning of the UFC. I think it’s an omen state is where me and Joe Rogan, we made our debut the same day. Joe Rogan came as an announcer. It was incredible so many years ago; it’s like almost like, it’s hard to even grasp like, no Joe Rogan was there before Dana White was there. Right? Yeah. So it’s pretty cool. So we debuted on the same day. And it was awesome, was a great experience. I had to face one of the biggest fears of my life, like just fighting huge adults, you know? Yeah. Yeah. It’s funny. I was just going back, was very, very fearful.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah.
Dr. Andrew Wells: I’m looking at your original fights, and these days go back to like you said the late ’90s. Like guys like Tank Abbott, Randy Couture. Like,
Vitor Belfort: Yeah.
Dr. Andrew Wells: How do you get in the ring and fight someone like that at that age? Wanderlei Silva, also a fellow Brazilian. That guy scares the crap out of me just being on TV.
Vitor Belfort: It’s true. It’s true. That’s part of it. Every time he gets here and if you don’t smile, you got to smile. Anybody that smiles? Never. That’s how a smile on your face is always beautiful.
Dr. Andrew Wells: That’s amazing. Right?
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah. So I started studying Brazilian jiu-jitsu about 10 years ago. And don’t let that timeframe fool you. I’m not great at it at all. I’ve been a blue belt for way too long. But I studied under Professor Keith Owen. I’m not sure if you know who he is. He passed away a little over a year ago. But he studied directly under Master Pedro Sauer, who studied directly under Rickson Gracie and Hélio Gracie. So I get excited whenever I hear names like the Gracies and Carlson Gracie and, of course, Vitor Belfort here. And so for those who have, to any degree, been involved in jiu-jitsu, your respect for not only jujitsu but MMA goes up immensely, just because you know how much technique and skill is involved in that whole process? And so maybe for those who are listening to this, tell us a little bit about what got you started in jiu-jitsu in the first place and kind of what led to you getting into UFC? I’d love to hear that myself.
Vitor Belfort: Yeah, so jiu-jitsu. It’s a martial art that was made by this Gracie family. So Carlos Gracie was Carlson’s father. Carlson. So the whole lineage is free. I know people don’t talk about it, but I mean, where I grew up. So Carlson Gracie was the son of Carlos, the creator of and then his brother was Hélio Gracie. Hélio learned from Carlos. Carlos, start sharing the martial arts and just bring it to the family. So as this thing started growing in thinking about… Carlson was the guy who saved the name because they opened up a gym. And on that gym, they had these two guys they went out the gym and they challenged the Gracies… Ivan Gomes. So Ivan Gomes is the guy that they’re one of the tougher opponents of Carlson Gracie. They say that fight was a draw. But they were massive guys very strong guys. And they learn under them. But both of them are trying to beat Hélio Gracie in a fight. Beat the crap out of Hélio Gracie. And he was the bigger guy but you know. And then Carlson Gracie was revenge. They say Carlson we need someone to avenge the fight … and then Carlson becomes the face, the guy of MMA, valid to mixed martial arts. So he was the front runner he was the guy who would defend the name of the family for somehow the Carlson and Hélio they fought Carlos died. Carlos you know they had a fighting over things you know like over housing… they bought with the money and that was my money. So it was just a fight. So Carlson was trying to train fighters to beat the Gracies. So Hélio Gracie and Hickson Gracie all this lineage comes from the Gracie come from Hélio Gracie. Even Gracie Baja, so everything comes from Hélio’s lineage. We have a lot of fighters you know, a lot even before that guys they fought they have many other guys and also that they fought in defending the jiu-jitsu name of Carlson and then Carlson is always challenging Hickson Gracie to fight his guys and they protect Hickson was the man so it was the whole fight long the day and I thought was very stupid and I would say Carlson I don’t know why you’re fighting against your own family but that was his goal you know his goal was to go out and win Lucha Libre and that came in challenging jiu-jitsu in Brazil, Carlson was the guy who trained fighters like Pablo Popovich, Murilo Bustamante and Wallid Ismael they fought on the same night against the guys so he was the guy that trained them. And so it was was everything was martial arts versus martial arts, which martial arts is more effective. So jiu-jitsu was something that they Gracie Jiu-Jitsu now becomes more. You know, it’s like when you start mixing things that are like mixed martial arts. When you start mixing arts. That’s when you have the mixed martial arts you mix before you don’t mix either your jiu-jitsu fighter you are Lucha Libre or Karate you have bought a kickboxing. That’s how people want to become knowing like my martial arts more effective. So that was the whole purpose of UFC is proving the martial arts and jiu-jitsu prove when you don’t know what I know, I have an advantage because jiu-jitsu give you the leverage that where the small guy can fight a bigger guy, but if he doesn’t know the art, but I’m used to knowing the art and Carlson used to say ‘Size matters.’ He said ‘size matters’ when he used to tell me Vitor when these guys started learning, you know, martial arts, you know, it’s easy to defeat a small guy, so he always knew that size matters. And I remember the size matter, and I’m gonna say, but I was starting to say “Carlson, I know size matters, but speed matters. The speed matters.” And my thing was our speed speed speeds the fast. You know, how can you get onboard fast? How can you get the clamp down fast? How can you pass the guard fast? So I was wanting to the speed game. So that’s what I was very successful in jujitsu because I started putting speed in my movement. And, and that’s how I achieved success. But also, I was smart enough to say, ‘man, no, I gotta mix martial arts, I have to put boxing.’ And I remember I was a very young guy … from Carlson, I was like, 16 you know, and I was beating all these adults, they used to do open hands in the gym, you know, you just open and just to do like no Gi, then you see, and a lot of people wanted to do that. And some people they didn’t want to do because it was crazy. Imagine you train your whole class with GI and then I finish the class. Okay, let’s see. So you take the gear, just the top of the GI and then you open hands and then you guys see that everybody’s hair was red and you know how to defend? Yes. And I used to be very successful because I knew boxing. So I used to hit everybody on the face, the body. And and Carlson saw that and said ‘My God, this kid’s gonna be amazing.’ And I was to do weights I used to looking to do other stuff. I came from different sports as well. So but I was very against this fight, this rivalry. I thought it was ridiculous. You know, this guy hate that guy. You know? I remember they have this rivalry between Gracie Baja and Carlson Gracie was so ridiculous and it become a time that I you know, I want to relate, I love you know, everybody I love the Gracie and I want to be related to Rick Hickson you know, I want to be so I wanted to learn from different people and but you could not learn that way you’re a traitor. If you do this if you train with a guy you’re a traitor. And I was doing myself and and I and I cannot accept that that culture that culture this we’re talking about adults. Adults, you know, with angry with and I’m gonna say with this, this is disgusting. We’re not going to grow, we’re not going to become successful if we divide. And that was the whole story no, that was the whole story. So I know it’s a lot of people don’t know that story, but that’s how the mixed martial arts jiu-jitsu, yeah, I know it is so big right now people don’t even know the story of jiu-jitsu. Some people know this, they know that. I know the real story. Because I lived, I lived with Carlson, I was the one who brought Carlson to America. I was the one who made his name famous in America, I was the guy that promises Carlson, I was 16 years old said promising your name is going to be known, because his whole thing was his name. They need to know that I’m Carlson Gracies. I defend the name of the family that I was the same person who knew that but don’t take away from the other guy. They doing a great business. And I think it’s so sad. Because imagine if the Gracie’s was together, imagine if Hickson and Carlson and then all these people they will be owning the UFC now along you know, with all these guys so but I mean where where this ends up, you know, as I said when you start bringing hate, you know, that was the thing for me it was Carlson had the hate on his heart towards you know, his uncle. And that was never resolved. Or somehow no one couldn’t help him to resolve this with him. It is a lot of ego and I was just doing a video right now that I’m going to be posting soon in my social media about ego. So ego stands for effort, you know, grit and obedience, that’s for me, when you feed your ego, you know, your ego centric, you know, you have greedy, and then the O, I’m trying to find the O because in obedience, it’s something that you obey the process, you obey effort and you obey greed. And when you start obeying, you know, you become egocentric, you became greedy, you start out during the process, it becomes becomes very contagious.
Dr. Andrew Wells: Vitor, do you think one of the things I find fascinating about you—and we’re talking about ego—is how you define that as effort, grit, and obedience? The thing that amazes me about you is you’re still fighting. I didn’t realize that because I don’t really follow martial arts very much now. Look, I was reading about you this week. Not only did you really start as the UFC started, even before like you mentioned before Joe Rogan was there. I don’t know of anyone else that started at that time period that’s still fighting. Like that’s incredible. You box, you had a match a month ago. Yep. I wanted to ask you in the interview, why are you still fighting? And I don’t mean that in a desperate or disrespectful way. I’m amazed by it, but what drives you to still be in a sport like this that requires so much physically and mentally and so much dedication and your version of ego?
Vitor Belfort: I love that question. Why doesn’t offend me at all? I say there is no stupid question. I teach my kids there is no stupid question. The “why” question is the most important question. And this “why” is important because we are defined by society. Society establishes things. Like, even then, a “why” is established? MMA is a young man’s sport, it’s true, an amazing young man’s sport. Boxing is not, you know, why MMA is a young man’s sport? Because we require so much joint movement, and joints get stiff as you get older and age. So I do a lot of mobility. I developed the Delta fitness lifestyle, my workout way because I see older people, they have a tendency to be stiff, they become very stiff. And that’s part of the journey, you know? If you have a car, you have to put oil and yeah, I call oil the annoying thing for me. That noise is very important. You have to have an anointing, and anointing is something that you stick. I love to be anointed by God because the anointing of God is something that you have to develop, you have to search, you have to smash that grape or the olives to create that oil. So that’s called effort and immune. So why I still fight is simple. I love competition. And I never had a chance to box, and I was doing a few. I had an offer from Muhammad Ali. I’m a lawyer to become a boxer when I was 20 years old. They offered me a $2 million contract to leave UFC, and back in the area, you have to fight two guys in the night to win $50,000. And it was very seductive, that country. But, you know, when I asked them, I said, “Will I be able to do UFC?” They say, “No, you have to quit UFC to become a boxer.” So I said no. And the problem with people in business and fighting, as I understand when you sign up to play for, let’s say, you play for the Miami Dolphins, you’re not allowed to play for any other team. But the Miami Dolphins player, he can become another thing if he’s not against his season, you know, if he’s not against, he can be kicking open a business, he can do all the business but not in football. So in fighting, I say I’m gonna box. Why I cannot do anything when I’m not boxing, you know why? And I think it’s ridiculous. And I understand that this contract to this facility thing, you know, it’s important, but if I’m not competing against you, why can I do something? So that’s the whole fight that fighters have now, and promoters are very smart. They lock them in a contract. They don’t want them to do things. But I mean, it’s pretty cool when you can do multiple things. Like you see, LeBron James is not just a basketball player. He does things, and I don’t agree with some things that he does, but I mean, he’s going to do it. And other guys, you may not agree with that guy, but I mean, he’s doing something else. So I could not do, and so now I’m pursuing something that I love. I love boxing. Boxing is, for me, it’s like a digit. I know a lot of people love Jiu-Jitsu, but for me, boxing is a martial art. So I was the guy who brought boxing to MMA. So I’m creating waves, of punches, of angles, and it’s just fascinating what you can do with two hands. And when you’re putting together combinations, like a number with two hands, one, two, you can do three, four. So everything I call everything’s odd and even. So we hear we have infinite numbers, you understand. So that one is jab, two is Robin Hood, it’s grace. So boxing is a map. It’s very fascinating if you love Jiu-Jitsu, and the last thing you can do at an older age, you can do as you age, as you become older, you know, you’re 70 to 80, you cannot put the GI, you can stand on the mat, you can feel the vibe, but you can never roll around. And it’s very painful in your joints when you start getting older. And it’s a lot, a lot so people get hurt a lot. Not just because of the tapping window, roll with the right people, but you’re not the same. So it’s hard. No, you cannot do this. And so I love fitness, I love wellness, I love well-being. So to answer your question is that I’m so fascinated with preparation. So the way I keep my battles simple, I am a body, I have a soul, and I have a spirit, I gotta change these three elements. So I’m never going to stop being a competitor. You know, I have three amazing kids. They are amazing competitors. So it’s if I’m, I’m a model for my kids. And I say, Can I push this envelope a little longer so my kids can start coming? See my fight. So my kids are coming to see me fight. So I’m fighting until my wife and my kids say Dad, it’s time to stop. So they love, and I feel good. So when my body cannot handle any more, I’m gonna and I know, maybe I have three more, maybe just one more, I don’t know. But I’m taking my last fight as my last fight. And I think my approach of life I’m taking this day as my last day, maybe tomorrow not come. So that’s my approach of life. And one thing that like to encourage people, you’re never too young to start something, and you’re never too old to start something. So when I say finish, finish something like we want to finish this race. And that’s some young people are finishing their racing or today you’re going to die. We know a lot of people are going to die today, and they die without doing their best. They’re dying without giving them. So for me, it’s feeling your ego is like you putting your effort all in. We have to put all in. You cannot make it non-negotiation, don’t try to make us discount, you know, cells. That’s the only pace you want to pay full price, effort, and then have your grip. You cannot negotiate with your grip. You have to not, not trying to make a discount, don’t have nothing on sale. It’s full price, and obedience comes with full practice, you know if you don’t obey the whole process. So it’s fun. It’s been a competition, feeling that nervous system, you know the parasympathetic and sympathetic, this kind of a conflict from each other is pretty cool, man.
Dr. Chad Woolner: I think that’s a perfect segue, what you just shared there with Erchonia lasers. I’m curious as to how, first off, you’ve connected with Erchonia. But second, how these lasers have played a role in helping you with your overall fitness and performance.
Vitor Belfort: I have a good friend of mine, I call him a family member of mine. He’s like a brother to me, Big Brothers, Dave. You know, Dave was always from Arizona; he has a huge, one of the best enemy teams. He helped set up all these camps for all the spiders you set up. I know a lot of people don’t even know who David is; David is a guy who provides the infrastructure behind the scenes. You don’t know what goes behind the scene, but he’s the guy who is really just to help him, but he’s putting his effort in. I admire people that are just putting their—they put your mouth where your money is. So he’s really not just putting he’s put his whole body there, you know, he’s helping. We have, can you see who’s fighting, you know, now for the title. So he’s very aware of putting this stuff and creating this longevity and healing. And he knows so much about the recovery system. So he says, “Victor, I have a laser for you, why don’t you use the laser?” So I started using this laser, and it’s pretty powerful. And like I said, everything that you have any tool that you have to add into your system. And I mean, I believe if you do your part, not just what I cannot credit to one thing is doing a lot of little things together, and they add together, they become a huge unity. The problem is when you start putting your hope on this, oh, take. No, no, you can’t, you gotta have this, plus that. Plus that plus, so it’s a lot of small elements together. That’s what makes who you are. And you see, look, my I have five, you know, five fingers in each chain. And then I have my wrist and then I have my forearm and then I have my, my biceps and then comes and goes to my neck. So my whole body, what’s the most important part of my body, every part is important. And that’s the realization of understanding. Doing a little, a lot, my little, and that’s my thing, you know, and if you do the laser one time, not gonna help you, but if you do it consistently if you’re part of the lifestyle, and actually I’m waiting for my laser here because I had a tour pack, I gotta, I hope my laser is on the way. I got to start my treatment.
Dr. Chad Woolner: That’s awesome. So in terms of what you’ve noticed, using the lasers, obviously you’re using them for helping with injuries and things like that. Have you noticed any improvement in terms of just performance? How else have you used the lasers?
Vitor Belfort: Like I said, you know, I think everything I do perform you know, ever drink whatever simple water, I think my body gets stronger and for everything that I do is just like I said, is 1% a day. Yeah, I don’t try. I don’t try, I don’t, I don’t get praised. The only thing that does 100% Is God decides everything you have to keep doing. I believe in consistency. You know, I believe in consistency. If you tell me that you’re going to do this for one week, you’re going to be good and goodness and knowing you like you know, I believe God can do it in one week. But I mean, unfortunately, it’s a process, you know, your healing happening. By process, you know, a process of little things. And of course, you know, lasers I feel like it’s part of my lifestyle. It’s part of what I do. When I’m injury. You know, I like to know they have multiple things to do but I mean, it is simple. I use the laser more for recovery, maybe you store a lot of things you can be done the laser so you’ve got to use it like I said if you do one time because you’re going to have the results. I’m sorry you’re not you got to do you got to do more than one time. Protocol to do and for everything ever protocols. I call him and call it joy endorsed AV to do this do this setting is so confusing but no I just have to follow the lead and just and that’s the thing. Just obey. Obey the process.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah. Yeah, that’s a great way.
Dr. Andrew Wells: We’ve had the privilege now of interviewing several people that are professional athletes. We interviewed Henry sudo, Elijah Garcia who’s an up and coming boxer, all using lasers in their training in the recovery. And I think for especially for families like yours, Vitor, who know you have an active family, you have a son who’s a very talented football player, you’re in combat sports, you get kicked in the head, punched in the head.
Vitor Belfort: And again, I got a volleyball player and that track field. So my kids are amazing. My daughter is the fastest girl in Florida. Wow, she’s the fastest, going for my daughter. She’s the best Libero in the country. And my son is one of the best quarterbacks in the country. So I have these three amazing athletes. So then you ask me why I compete. I love to become an example in my house. You know, I love to do things in my house. They don’t eat sugar. I don’t eat, I don’t drink alcohol. I don’t smoke, drink nothing, nothing that changes my behavior. And I know the science Oh, this so this sub Yes. Now they say alcohol gives it an edge, small dose vs. They want to just make you sell more, more wine or more liquor. So just to understand, if you want to live longer, if you want to have a good life, stay with the earth, everything that is produced. And when I say Earth, I’m not saying things that you know, because sometimes art produces some bad stuff. You know, you’re not going to, I don’t believe we’ll, is going to make you perform better, which is going to make this flow. We’re going to give you more hunger, we’re going to give you more desire to crave for sweets. So Oh, but we, it is good to treat epilepsy. Okay, great. I don’t have epilepsy, I’m an athlete. And I see a lot of athletes are smoking and doing all this and become the advocate, oh, take your pain away. No, take your pain away, go to laser, go do massage, go do some therapy, go looking for some turmeric and some good things, they’re not going to change your mind. You’re playing with your person to take in symmetry. So I’m very in favor. That’s why I love music because that’s something that is not going to change my just gonna help healing where I’m hurt. So the problem with people they want to treat things, bringing something that will give you pleasure, you know, like alcohol give you a pleasure with you know, people live, Happy Hour go workout, go do a workout, go for a run. Nobody wants to sit down, produce dopamine by taking a sip and something. And now we see the interest is huge. We have liquids all the heavy every actor, every actor, every athlete, nothing they are they’re launching their own liquor. The killer is all heavy stuff. And I’m telling you just gonna mess up your whole system. And I mean, if you want to live longer.
Dr. Andrew Wells: Yeah, I think, I think Vitor, you’re bringing up a really good point. And when you look at your The really cool thing about your family is I think, number one, they’re all very talented people. But I think a lot of people will assume oh, they just have really good genes, you have Vitor who’s somehow some superhuman, he’s got this beautiful model wife, and somehow they just created these by accident, these superhuman children, but I want people to recognize and especially we have a lot of doctors that listen to this podcast, is that what you’re talking about, in the example that you’re leaving, leading with your kids about the choices they make and the lifestyle you guys lead? That it’s multifaceted? It? It’s mental, it’s spiritual, and it’s physical. And it’s very well rounded. And so here you have a guy who’s 46 years old, still competing at a high level, he has children who are competing at the top of their heap and in terms of athletics that wasn’t produced by accident. It wasn’t just lucky jeans it was effort and I love Have you written a book by the way on your on ego?
Vitor Belfort: No
Dr. Andrew Wells: You should.
Vitor Belfort: I really, because I have this thing called I’m doing like a course of setting up performance scores. Not just for athletes, but for businessmen for people in the industry. So I’m selling this, and we’re talking about the ego is like who you are. So what is ego? It’s just the personnel. And, and it’s funny, I was just sharing the So what is, you know? selfish, selfish when you want something so much for yourself that you want just for you. And what is being greedy is the same thing you want everything for you. So we live in a world today where people are very selfish, they’re very greedy. And they don’t understand the process of effort, grid. Obedience, you know, they’re egocentric, it’s everything about them, you know, me, me, me, me. So in this book, in this course, I’m going to talk about the flip of a ladder. The flip of a ladder is called the rear athletes. And I’m telling you, I discovered that when my wife said, “You’re so selfish,” I used to hear this every day from my wife, “You’re selfish, she’s so selfish,” right? Is this around you? You know, you don’t understand. This is one of the beginning of a marriage of selfishness, and I say great. How can I be no more self because the life of an athlete is selfish. And even I’m encouraging my wife to do a course for women’s athletes because a lot of guys are going through that stage right now. And Harry’s the who is going to know his wife, just a baby, you know, she’s pregnant again. And now we have a fight. You know, it’s, it’s, you know, and my wife says, it’s funny because you had a head coach, you had a mentor, coach, you had a nutrition coach, you had all types of coach, what about me? I mean, you how I’m your mom, your wife? What about me, I have your kids, we’ll see you going, how you think I feel when you go into the rain? I think your kids feel when you go into the rain. Can you know another side? We don’t have mental health coach, we don’t have multi. So she has to learn the hard way. And today, you know, and let’s say don’t just apply it. Let’s talk about, you know, the wife of a quarterback. Do you imagine what is going through her mind? You know, she’s there. You know, when they’re winning, everybody loves her. But when they’re losing when they’re picked, everybody hates her, they’re not just gonna talk about you, they’re gonna talk about her, she’s a slut, or there’s whatever it is, but you and your wife, your husband, the yelling in your husband. So this is how the kids mind? How’s the family deal with that? You know, the whole stage and just yelling? You ever thought about these kids? You know, and my wife makes me understand you say, “Okay, how can I be less selfish.” So I called the flip of a ladder is as the athlete. And every businessman This is not just for this golfer, businessman for people that have family, if you have a wife and kids and you haven’t had success in marriage, you’re gonna have to know how to flip one letter called the letter M. Me, me, me when the Me Me, Me Generation. Me means you have more than one kid. You know what, it’s me, me, me, me. So to me, it’s you flip the letter become we flip just one letter. And another thing, choose like the team that has no team has the wire but has n, you flip the team because we know. But when you have a W, you flip the W become me. And you have an AI personality, you have a person so you have just one person. So I have a whole system that I’m gonna go talk about this whole system, you know, to win. You know, I, you know, it’s a lot of subjects. But I mean, make you realize that, you know, and I had to be selfish. And when I was reading the Bible, I call the selfish love. What is it selfish love? selfish love, is I have to love me first to love you. That’s what Jesus said. So Jesus was very selfish, in a way. And I call the selfish love comes from God. So I told my wife, I say, “Honey, if you feel like I’m selfish, I’m going to turn his selfish way into something good. So I’m going to make a part of it. So we stopped being part of it is part of my cam, including her, including the kids, I explain them. I brought sponsors to say what about this? We should I should put my image on this no issue. So I make them part of it because he’s a businessman. And of course, has a limit right there. Of course, he’s not gonna be including them in everything. I’m not going to bring them to the ring with me. So but I mean, in a way, I think we all do have success. I can say how I measure success is another great question. How do I measure success? How fast how speed? Do I measure success? How is my internal life, how my internal self If I’m okay with it, so you see a lot of champions a lot of winners, they are they need to prove themselves more, you know, they, they need to show they have money they need to buy card and to show diamonds. So we have a crisis of identity today. For sure. You know, people have a very crisis of like, man, they didn’t know who they are. And now they come in with all types of oh, I’m this I’m that. I’m, I feel like I’m not again, you know, not respecting me, I’m a little kid me as alligator, we’re going to a time that people are so crazy about this? So for me, it’s simple. You know, you’re either you who are you know, people don’t know who they are they trying to become something they are not. And people are trying to create this as a rule or respect. Now, you know, no, you are boy, you got your boys read from your girl, you go through girls wrestling, I’m not gonna I’m not gonna have a big guy with figures a girl but he has a huge snake between his legs, he’s gonna go in the same bathroom, my daughter, no way. No way. So So we come into a point where people are very distinct with this identity crisis that we live in. So you have to be very selfish. First, you got to be selfish, and my selfish has to understand that it is including a lot of people, and they have time for everything. And I’m very specific in this house here with the sacrifice and other days. I was having fun with my wife. She was always kids training too much, you know, they need a break. I was just hearing you know, it was Go ahead. And she was giving a lecture for me, you know, no, this they need to do this. And I say, Honey, do you have a belt in your office? Do you have a metal Olympic mountain and you’re like, I need to know what you conquered. To have that kind of mentality. And I say, Honey, they’re not doing enough. They gotta do more. And that made me realize, I made her when I say Honey, I understand. I respect you what? What you know, but right now the one I know the grind, and you got to understand the grass to get bigger. And my wife bought into that when my wife bought into that now. She comes with that mentality. But also the love of a mother. Oh, no, the knee okay, they didn’t understand they have that touch. But um, I was before I got into the podcast, I was just with my son watching his throne session that I film yesterday and it was on him. It’s Coach coins coach, we talking? Why I’m like that because either I am always in one or loud. I cannot be between so it’s a lot of little things that have to be done properly. But, but we Okay, people, okay, oh, it’s okay. Will you be fine? No, you not be fine. I cannot admit I cannot accept that. And that’s the life of a fighter the life of an athlete, not just you’re not just winning inside the ring or the octagon or that feel the life of an athlete, it’s happening outside of that field. And I always like to measure my kid, let’s say, the way I measure a man, by their family, I want to meet their wife, I want to meet their kids because sometimes you’re very successful in their environment. You’re very successful in business, you, you you have so much money, but your kid doesn’t want to be a kid. We have one of the wealthy men on the planet. His son has AI has an identity problem. And his father somehow doesn’t want to be your son. He wants to be associated with his father. So for me it is the measure like I got the so sad. And then I said, you know, how can I help this father? How can I help this son? And I feel in my heart how can I help them? Because I know the promise is so easy to be fixed. But for them it is so hard because they don’t understand the principle that I’m for me, that’s my wealth. That’s my measure of wealth. You asked me Victor, you very rich, very rich, very rich because I have that narrowed down very strong in the house. So
Dr. Chad Woolner: You know, what’s inspiring to me? Well, as I hear you share your experiences and your insights here. Vitor is far too often we hear the common tale of whether it’s athletes or performers or musicians or actors and entertainers, right. And it’s the all too common tale with where they rise and they reach their kind of Pinnacle. And then unfortunately, there’s this kind of slow and steady decline that takes place because As of the selfishness that you talk about, because of the, you know them focusing on pleasure and all the different things that we know. And yet it seems that you’ve kind of seen that already. You recognize that at an early point. And it seems like your your life is still reaching this incredible trajectory because of the fact that you’re linking so much of your identity and your your perception of success and fulfillment in life, around family around service to others around all these incredibly meaningful things. I’m reminded as you’re talking there, a very wise man, a leader in my church years ago said no success can compensate for failure in the home. And no
Vitor Belfort: Success. Yeah, right down down. No success.
Dr. Chad Woolner: No success can compensate for failure in the home. And, and I just as you’re talking there about, like your involvement with your kids and this drive to continue to help them it’s very obvious that the motivation behind that is out of love is out of a desire to see them become the best versions of themselves. And so that’s just inspiring to me to hear you say that because I think other people will really resonate with that when people realize because for me, I can’t agree more that like, my greatest fulfillment and happiness in life comes from my relationships, first and foremost with my spouse and my kids, but relationships with others too, is is a huge part of what what drives me as well. And so it’s neat, it’s neat to hear that really, really incredible and
Vitor Belfort: We live in and that crisis of identity comes to a point where you know the wrong is right and the right is wrong. So and the problem is I was healing my friend was talking about who are the science teachers and because when you go to the school you will learn from the school MRI their teacher science, but who are the people that you learn from the people there aqueous people they don’t believe in God they don’t believe in exist so you’re learning something that can be a such a lie, but they then adapt to the society as Oh, now you’re learning the subject. I think sports are supposed to be great for, I mean, sports competition. i Oh, I’m not good at sport. Okay, go be a musician. Find something. So the problem with this, everything evolves, the only thing didn’t evolve was education. Education is the same so it’s so bad and you see all this billionaires creating their own schools because they don’t believe in the education system. And some millionaires put their school in a public school. They don’t care because the only thing good is money, so I’m very aware I’m not happy with the education system today. I’m not happy the way my kids are learning and I use sport as a lesson so the great teachers are great and colossal because they teach you failures, teach you know teach your grind, teacher dedication, determination. So I don’t believe in schools and now don’t get me wrong, technology makes people weak, make people lazy, and makes people fat. And I say it’s funny because before it’s great, we were talking about how technology is great. But if we can use technology to good but now using it like the example you’re in your house, you have the control. You don’t before you have to turn up, turn the TV on. And then you have a couch that the incline and you put so so everything should make you lazy don’t get up and then you have a Allbritton Nobody cooks anymore. So and then what to do you have a status so lazy and now don’t want to get rid of all this. You go to a supermarket. I don’t like to computer I don’t talk to computers. I don’t talk to Alexa. I don’t talk, you know, even I turned Alexa off because when I asked her to do something she does something totally different and say I don’t want to hear that. That’s not the music that was shut up. Like you know Alexa, we don’t play that kind of music in the house. And she can play me. She’s very mean so. So the fact that I’m very human and a lot of people, a lot people and I mean I know AI will take some jobs. One thing I have is the call critical thinking. I cannot do critical thinking and you can have my voice you can have my face you can have all but you cannot have my heart You cannot have my mind. So that is Nothing that you can subside. And I think today, AI is making us become robot. And you see kids, everybody’s on the phone, you go to social media, it’s ridiculous. So it’s such a pandemic, we gotta come the solution. And that’s why I want to teach my principles, my ego, I sort of feed your ego, because every day you wake up, you’re going to have to feed your ego, you’re either going to be greedy, or you’re going to have grit. You either you’re going to be, you know, full of yourself, you know, full of like it was sent you, or you’re going to embrace effort, you know, so you got to choose this thing, either you’re going to be obedient to all these things to the other thing, so obedience is something that you’re gonna be for good or for that you choose how you want to bake the process. So, to summarize, anything’s like how I measure success. It’s very important because I want to be successful, but how I measure success goes down to my roots. First, I go down to who I am. You know, what my faith is, what I believe? I believe in what God is in my mind. Oh, I believe in high power. I believe in meditation. That’s all BS. You believe in yourself. My God has a cross. My God has a way of living. My God went through what I call flesh. Because I don’t believe God has ever been in my flesh. He couldn’t tell me what to do. I don’t tell my kids what to do. I tell them to follow me. You know, do what I do not do what it says. So God for somehow has to become a person to go through my feelings, feeling angry, feeling hate, feeling betrayed. Feeling all this have to go through all that. So I can say okay, now, you guys follow me. So I might go. Cross has a way of living. My God has a name, Jesus, and why I’m not talking about religion. I’m not talking about a system that you do this, the sign of the cross your key, no, I’m not talking about that. I’m not talking about if I do a Lord’s prayer, if I keep doing my role by my sin, I’m going to be blessed. No, my God that I serve. He said, I’m going to give you problems. But my problem is going to be persistence, perseverance, and your perseverance is going to be faith. So I believe everything that the churches are selling to they all this motivation, oh, free from the depths not so why, you know, I believe you’re going to have to get problems, you need to have tribulation, you need to have because that’s the only way you’re going to see like when I build my muscles, I build my boss by what creating that, you know, intensity, you know, and I mean, inflammation is not bad for your body. That’s good, but what type of inflammation goes back to the laser. So I love the laser because the laser is like something so the reason has a light that goes inside is a very very, you know, so called the light you have to be the light we have to be the laser we have to be the let’s watch the requirements of God. Jesus said be the light of the word be the salt, the salt is another element this human I use a lot of salt in my in my healing process. I love salt. Salt is very important in bath with salt, you know, things like that, that scaling of muscles. So I think the measure of success of an athlete, the measure of success of a business owner, it’s wrong. They go to the bank and count how much I bought. I did this. I’m thirsty, okay, you are but when you die, you cannot take that thing with you my brother. You’re gonna go to hell, you’re gonna go to heaven. And you’re not going to go to to God and say, God, you know, I was a star at the core. I did this when I was NDP, you know, the press. So for me the measure of success or geach or Belfer. It’s my it’s my, my belief, my faith, my beliefs, my sister, my court. God is everything. God is not in the category of things God is first second or God is not my category of things. Either is everything or is nothing that for me that’s my thing. Either God is everything or is not and it’s hard for me to be everything so the second process is doing little noodle noodle is never good enough. Because that’s the way it is. And then in all the categories goes to my things that my beliefs you know, what are things that are that The most important things my thing. And when, and I made my and I did this homework with my kids. And I say give me I want five athletes that have an amazing marriage. I want five athletes that you think it’s relevant and you send me. I want to see them took so much time for them to find these five guys because they have a secondary third. And I’m understand, you know, but I mean, the problem is when you start making kids with different moms, it becomes a mess, it never becomes good, you can make it become good, especially if you have a little bit more money. Everybody says it’s fine, but emotionally never good. Emotion I’m talking about is never good. Emotion I’m talking about is never good. Emotion I’m talking about is never good. Emotion I’m talking about is never good. Emotion I’m talking about is never good. Emotion I’m talking about is never good. Emotion I’m talking about is never good. Emotion I’m talking about is never good. So you’re never going to be in a relationship, preparing to divorce. You never start a fight winning too quick. So my thing is, the problem of the world comes into relationships. People start friendships at the end right away because it’s all about what I have for me, what I have for me, and that’s, that’s basically, for me, the standard, why I keep fighting, why I keep doing business. And in a lot of business, I have to close I have to do this do the work because the people have the idea have the right people, I didn’t have the right people but doesn’t mean I’m not going to play it again, I’m not going to do it again, I’m not going to invest in somebody again. So that’s like buying a pack: your pack dies going by the pack because you have attachment with the pack. And in but what is the only one thing you can ever replace is you. You can ever replace you. And that’s why you’re back to identity. People don’t know who they are anymore. They’re just they’re just a piece of a marketing process that you buy what I want, you do what I want. So that’s kind of my, my, my literally my core values for you guys here.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah, amazing.
Dr. Andrew Wells: You know, I think that so this is such a valuable message for people to hear, especially today, as we record this in 2023 Such an important message and it really I can speak for Erchonia saying we really appreciate you promoting lasers at the fact that you use them in your routine and, and I think that’s an important thing. And they’re happy to support you and your efforts. And I think will
Vitor Belfort: Be the light of the world and be the laser of the world. That’s a good that’s a good so be the laser. Because that’s what I chose, laser laser is a deep light that goes into the tissues and NMR that’s the process of the light that the light can do to you and of course, get the right laser. Yeah, yeah.
Dr. Andrew Wells: Yeah, for sure. Thank you so much for being on the podcast. This was a really amazing episode. And we really weren’t sure what direction this podcast would go in. But I’m so happy that it went in the direction that it did. And really appreciate your lessons that you’re teaching people in life and the way that you lead yourself and your family. I think that that is just a really powerful message. And yeah, thank you so much. And hopefully we started get an opportunity to have you on again sometimes if you start to use lasers more with your your family and yourself 100%
Vitor Belfort: In the present spot of my life I’m waiting for my laser to actually arrived. I’m gonna be posting some stuff on social media, what you can do with the laser, and I think is what I like to be meaning why you guys come to my gym to Belfort Lifestyle. And in talking about I think you guys are going to show the website over there. So what it is is like a one hour class, it’s one hour class, half the class in the back half the class on the floor, you know, I have a whole science behind it called the two to one ratio, two to one ratio, four to one ratio. And I’m not going to go into details here. I’m going to make you guys very curious about it. So it’s all we treat the body as I think the body’s like, you are you are the healing. You’re the healing art or you decide what you put in your body. What do you think when you drink in what do you eat? That’s my theory behind. I teach all my students, you know, if you don’t think you can do something because you think so many evil thoughts, or some crazy thoughts, but you don’t dwell on it. So I call it my diet. It’s like I have to exercise every day, at least an hour. So when I’m not training for five, I’m going to my gym every day to develop the whole project. The whole point ogham system so I would love you guys to come on one day and try.
Dr. Andrew Wells: We’d love that. That’d be amazing.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah, that would be absolutely incredible.
Vitor Belfort: We’re gonna be doing something on that on the on the offering people online service as well so far.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Awesome. That’s amazing. And I understand that I didn’t want to end the episode without plugging this as well. You are involved in an organization to help support a fight against human trafficking. Is that correct?
Vitor Belfort: Yes, it. My sister was missing in 2004, three weeks before my title fight, this belt here. And since then, you know, we saw this human trafficking. It’s the largest trafficking in the world today. Because when you use cocaine, you have to buy it again. When you use weed, you have to buy again. Actually, we did not even have a drug. So, but when you eat a person, you can sell them every day. So as a 12-year-old kid, you only serve 25 guys a day. And we have tons of consumers and today Fortunately, we’re so glad to live in Florida because our governor DeSantis just put a few if you do something with a little kid, you get a death penalty. In California, oh my god, they tried to protect these pedophiles as much as they can. So I’m really in for protecting our children, but not just protecting the children. Now, and we’ve seen it with ethanol, I think this drone, you know, people are giving, and they give you to make you pass out, and they so they bring you to harvest your organs. So it’s so many things behind this human trafficking. And I think we also support. I think everyone should support that. And with all the social media with all the platforms that we have, no one gets missed. You know, no one should be missing today. So unfortunately, we are just trying to present, you know, that’s our and we’d like to bet on people they can do like other things as well trading these kids, these women’s and hope to educated people watch this evil behind the conscious society big.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Well, we certainly appreciate it. We’ll make sure to put links in the show notes. And yeah, it’s been an absolute pleasure and honor to get to chat with you, Vitor. My, my quote, among many quotes is do a little a lot rather than a lot a little. I like that a lot. So, and
Vitor Belfort: I read the quote that you said about, you know, success can be compensated
Dr. Chad Woolner: Finish for failure in the home. Absolutely. Absolutely.
Dr. Andrew Wells: So if you’re, I’m putting your ego, your ego on my wall in front of me here in front of my desk that’s going up this week.
Vitor Belfort: That’s awesome.
Dr. Andrew Wells: I’ll send you a picture of it. I love that, for sharing that.
Vitor Belfort: God Bless you guys. Take care. Yeah,
Dr. Chad Woolner: God bless you, too. Thank you, everybody, for listening. And we’ll chat with you guys on the next episode. Have a good one. Thanks for listening to the laser light show, be sure to subscribe and give us a review. If you’re interested in learning more about Erchonia lasers just head on over to Erchonia.com. There you’ll find a ton of useful resources including research news and links to upcoming live events, as well as our Erchonia community where you can access for free additional resources including advanced training and business tools. Again, thanks for listening and we will catch you on the next episode.
Vitor Belfort, a notable MMA fighter, brings attention to the importance of unity in the martial arts community, emphasizing its importance to fostering growth, success and diversity in training. After years of being so hard on his body, Belfort turned to his friend, Dave, who introduced him to the world of laser treatment and its mass contribution to physical, mental, and emotional wellbeing.
Vitor Belfort addresses the crisis of identity in society where the impact of technology has cultivated blurred boundaries between what is considered right and wrong. Emphasizing the importance of critical thinking and health, Belfort stresses the importance of expanding one’s palate to find the best treatment for them.
Vitor Belfort, a prominent MMA fighter, shares his experience with Low Level Laser Therapy in his strenuous profession.
“And of course, you know, lasers I feel like it’s part of my lifestyle. It’s part of what I do. When I’m injured. You know, I like to know they have multiple things to do but I mean, it is simple. I use the laser more for recovery, maybe you store a lot of things you can do with the laser so you’ve got to use it like I said if you do one time because you’re going to have the results.” -Vitor Belfort
“And that’s the realization of understanding. Doing a little, a lot, my little, and that’s my thing, you know, and if you do the laser one time, not gonna help you, but if you do it consistently if you’re part of the lifestyle, and actually I’m waiting for my laser here because I had a tour pack, I gotta, I hope my laser is on the way. I got to start my treatment.” -Vitor Belfort
Dr. Chad Woolner: Welcome to Miracle Mondays, a brand new segment of the Laser Light Show focused exclusively on practitioners and patients’ amazing and sometimes even unbelievable stories that are occurring each and every day all across the country. We hope that you really enjoy these. And hopefully, you can see that miracles are occurring all around us each and every day. These are the amazing things we get to hear and now you get to hear as well. So we hope you enjoy Miracle Mondays. All right, welcome to the show, everybody. Dr. Chad Woolner here with Dr. Andrew Wells. And on today’s episode of the Laser Light Show, we have with us our good friends, Dr. Ryan Manning and Denise Yakovenko. We’re really excited to hear about their story, they have a pretty amazing story to share with us. So with that being said, let’s get started.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Growing up in Portland, Oregon, I used to love going to laser light shows at the Oregon Museum of Science and Industry. They would put on these amazing light shows with incredible designs synced up to some of my favorite music from the Beatles to Pink Floyd to Jimi Hendrix and Metallica. They were awesome. Little did I know then that lasers would have such a profound effect on my life decades later. As a chiropractic physician, I have seen firsthand just how powerful laser therapy is at helping patients struggling with a wide range of health problems. As the leader in laser therapy, Erchonia has pioneered the field in obtaining 20 of the 23 total FDA clearances for therapeutic applications of lasers. On this podcast, we’ll explore the science and technology and physiology behind what makes these tools so powerful. Join me as we explore low-level laser therapy. I’m Dr. Chad Woolner, along with my good friend, Dr. Andrew Wells, and welcome to the Laser Light Show. All right, welcome to the show everybody. We are super excited to have Dr. Ryan and Denise here with us. This is going to be part of what we’re calling our Miracle Monday segment. We hear all the time all across the country and all across the world some pretty miraculous stories. And so rather than us relay them, what we figured we would do, which would be a far better approach is to hear proverbially straight from the horse’s mouth, so to speak in terms of these stories. And so Dr. Bryan and Denise, thank you guys so much for being here with us. We sure appreciate it. Thank you. So let’s kick this off. Tell us about how this all started and what the story is all about.
Struggling with finding the right care? See how LLLT compares to other medical treatments.
Dr. Ryan Manning: I’ll let Denise take the lead on this.
Denise Yakovenko: Well, yes, so I think in the summer, like half of my body when people were saying it might be a stroke and stuff. But my face was normal, and the speech wasn’t slurred. And people were saying that maybe just a nerve or something. It was like that for maybe a month. And then it went away for a week or two. And then that’s when I come back in full force, and all of my body except the right arm went numb. And that’s when the whole symptoms of a mess begin. Whereas like I couldn’t walk, I couldn’t feel anything. I couldn’t open a water bottle. Like literally, if you Google MS and see the symptoms, I had all of them except the vision. And probably more and it freaked me out like yeah, I would fall all the time. I could not like, I could not even do anything. I could not grab a cup of water. Like, yeah, and I was pretty devastated.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah.
Dr. Andrew Wells: I want the listeners if you’re listening to this on a podcast, we’re recording this on zoom so we can see Denise. You’re, you’re a young and healthy appearing male, right? Oh, how old are ya?
Denise Yakovenko: I’m 34. I’m super healthy. Like, I don’t drink, I’ve never drank. I’ve never smoked. I exercise regularly. I ate so healthy. And I was so pissed at my body for doing this to me. I was like ‘I’m taking such good care of you. And that’s how you repay me for this?’ Yeah, and I could not believe how bad it was.
Dr. Andrew Wells: You don’t fit like the typical like the typical image of somebody who has like a chronic health issue like, let alone something like MS, which is a very scary devastating diagnosis and so … That must have been pretty scary to not know what was happening, given the fact that you’re, you know, obviously taking care of yourself.
Denise Yakovenko: Yeah, I think there were only like two options at the end, it’s like it’s either a brain tumor or MS. I was hoping for the brain tumor because at least you can cure that. You know, but nothing.
Dr. Andrew Wells: Think about that. I don’t know if I’ve ever heard anyone say ‘I hope it’s a brain tumor.’ There you were, well, the option the other two options you had. Wow. How did you guys do well, let me ask you this, what was the first thing that you did? So you had these symptoms that came back in a nasty way after this kind of sort of week of not feeling it? But what was the progression of things that you did?
Denise Yakovenko: Um, well, yeah. At the end, it was. All of a sudden, I lost control of everything in my body. And I was not able to do anything. I could not feel my body, I could not feel if I’m wearing clothes or not, I could not control my bowel movements, like everything in my body just shut off except the right arm, which is not very useful. But so I went to the doctor, she prescribed me a week of steroids, like the high dosage, steroids and stuff. did absolutely nothing, except gave me all the side effects. I was like, I’m doing it. Yeah. But then I came back to her. I was like, I’m sorry, it did nothing. And I don’t want to do that. Like I only get even worse, like, I still have no feelings. I still have. Like, I can barely walk. I can function and stuff. Yeah, and then that’s when Ryan comes in. And he offers to do the laser treatments or something. Like he knows better about that. And I think it’s time for him too.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Did you know Ryan beforehand?
Denise Yakovenko: Yes. I knew him as a massage therapist. Yeah.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Okay. Okay. Yeah. Enter. Dr. Manning,
Dr. Ryan Manning: Yeah, hello. So I guess I’ll pick up the story in December when the symptoms really come back because that was the first time that I had been told about them. So, you know, when I think he had a couple, like a two-week delay in getting to the neurologist and in that time, you know, the symptoms got pretty severe. So I said, Come over, we’ll just treat your immune system, I’m going to put you under this rellena. So I know this around is only a laser lipo FDA approved, but trust me, it is so much farther, further a great healing device than it gets credit for. So I put them under the lasers. And he gave him, you know, probably about a half hour before I treated him. And I mean, Denise was so bad at this point, I had to help them in and out of the RV because we do mobile laser lipo in an RV, so we can take it on location. So I brought the RV to his house where he was living and had to help him in and out of the RV. And so he gets up, and he goes, you know, like, I feel something I feel so I feel different. I feel an energy, I can’t really. And this is one of the most common things that we hear when you really give people a dose of laser, they go, I feel an odd energy inside of me. It’s something that I haven’t felt before. So I can’t really describe it. I just feel different. I feel better. But I feel different. And so I said, Hey, I’ll take anything at this point. And you know, I believe actually after the first session, that you actually walked a little bit different. You had a little more of a pep in your step. A little more stability. Is that correct? Denise? Do you remember that?
Denise Yakovenko: I don’t remember. But yeah, I just Yeah. Fair enough. I’m sure that yeah, no, yeah, I’m sure I did.
Dr. Ryan Manning: And so I think I treated him three times, two or three times in that short period of time and that was where he was waiting to see the neurologist. And then I really lost track of Denise because he was in the medical world and on steroids. So now cut to so this was in I believe, December, the December symptoms were December that the symptoms were so bad. And then he goes off into the medical world and steroids. Well, in March I just you know, happened to remember I’m like Jeff, how’s Denise doing and he goes, he’s actually doing quite well. And I said I just got This new laser, I just got this green one. Now I have all three colors, which is so exciting because you stimulate all four proteins on the mitochondria at one time. It’s like having a car that you’re finally firing on all cylinders. So I said, Jeff, get Denise over here, and I’ll just treat them. I’ll treat him for free. So at that time, I found out that he was doing the cryo therapy. And so I, you know, Denise comes back into my world, and we do an exam and talk to him. And he goes, you know, like, I’m actually doing a lot better than the major problems that I have, and really, it was the only problem that you had was that your index fingers were numb.
Denise Yakovenko: So my fingers, yeah. And I still had an MS hug. And I still wasn’t able to run.
Dr. Andrew Wells: Right. But I Wait, you said you had the MS. What? A
Denise Yakovenko: MS hug. It’s basically when your ribcage is, it feels like someone is constructing it. It’s like you can take a full breath and stuff.
Dr. Ryan Manning: Oh, okay. Okay. Well, I didn’t, I didn’t know I think that was left out in the running was left out, you know, but primarily, I recalled, the fingers were numb. So you know, I took all three colors, really nailed them, did it in the mouth. And then just all over the brain and the whole body just scanning him, you know, constantly for about a half hour. And he gets up. And it was the same exact thing that he said the very first time and the other times that I’d worked on him I feel a little bit different. I feel like something but no major changes, you know, but I feel something definitely happened. So the next morning, I write to him, I go, how are you doing? He goes, Well, my fingers, I can feel my fingers again. And that’s not normal. That’s, you know, hasn’t been that way since the symptoms came on in December. And I just was blown away. I mean, it was hard for me to actually wrap my head around how somebody could have lesions on their brain and their spinal tracts, you know, enough to go. I still have symptoms. And then overnight, they’re gone. It just doesn’t. I don’t know how to wrap my head around it, you know, knowing how fast nerves regenerate. But I said, I mean, I know he’s not lying. So I’ll take it. And so at that point, I just said, you know, I want to see you next week to reinforce it. So the next week comes along, I see him again, I go, how are you? And he’s like, Well, my fingers are still normal. He goes, but what I didn’t tell you last week, he goes because I didn’t want to jinx it. And I wanted to tell you your face. He goes, not only were my fingers normal, but I ran a mile. And that was absolutely shocking. And he goes I literally have no MS symptoms. And it’s just to this day right now I literally have chills on me because I’m like, It’s impossible, it seems impossible to have that happen. So if I’m not mistaken. And Denise, you can correct me that morning, you had actually seen your MS doctor and they were like this isn’t supposed to happen. I can’t believe that you actually, you know, are sorry that you have no symptoms. He goes, I can’t legally tell you not to take your medication. But off the record. I’m telling you, I wouldn’t take it unless I actually had symptoms. And so as we stand today, oh, and so what happened was I said, you know, because Denise is also an avid runner. He loves to run marathons that are trained for him and obviously can’t do that. So I said, let me know when you get two miles. So I think it was a week later I texted him I’m like, Denise, did you get your two miles? He goes no, but I just did a four mile hike with 1000 feet of elevation basically, like not running, but at a clip that is so sufficient that nobody really ever wants to hike with me because it’s so fast. And this isn’t two weeks, two and a half weeks. Wow. And he’s literally back. So if I said anything wrong, Denise go ahead and correct me or if there’s anything you want to add. Feel free.
Denise Yakovenko: Well, yeah, the only reason why I wasn’t able to do a two-mile run and stuff. It’s because I was out of shape. Because I couldn’t move for like half a year.
Dr. Andrew Wells: And were you, Denise, were you given by your doctors the MS. Diagnosis?
Denise Yakovenko: Yeah, I have an official MS diagnosis. I think I have like 15,16 lesions in my brain and seven and up. They stopped counting, I think, in my spine. You Yeah. And yeah, to this day, I have zero symptoms. I thought, like she, my doctor said that I might never get the feeling back in my feet, my legs or my hands. Like, I can do everything. I’m healthier than ever. And if this can help someone else, because I was so devastated, like, all of a sudden, I turned into a severely handicapped person, I could not do anything, I would need assistance for everything. And I’m now back to normal, healthier than ever. Yeah, it is a miracle. To me, it is a miracle. And I’ve never taken any MS medications. I haven’t even started well, except for the steroids that time. But yeah, did nothing to me. Wow.
Dr. Andrew Wells: You don’t hear these stories very often. It sounds like your doctors didn’t hear, you know, they don’t hear these stories very often. First, first and foremost, um, you know, obviously really happy for you that you have your life back. Something that disappeared really quickly and almost seemingly back very quickly, as well as pretty amazing. And we’re happy that you are where you are today. What does the future look like? So we know that you did laser therapy, you’ve been doing cryo therapy, I imagine there’s probably some other things that you’ve done as well in your regimen to kind of get back on track. But what is in terms of maintaining your health? Now, what does that look like for you?
Denise Yakovenko: Honestly, if I could still see Ryan once a month or late like once every two months, and I keep doing cryo, and that’s it. Like, oh, sorry. And I exercise I can now exercise because I have control of my body. I can now run I can do everything that I used to do. And yeah, nothing else changed. Diet hasn’t changed. Like, I’m not doing anything specific. It’s just
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah, and I would say that those things, the fact that you are already living a healthy lifestyle only played to your favor, and I’m sure we already know, I’m sure you already know that like, yeah, you know. But that’s still that’s really cool to hear you know that these tools have been able to help you in such a profound way. So I would echo exactly what Andrew said, we’re glad that you’re feeling better that you’re doing that you’re functioning better. That’s huge.
Denise Yakovenko: So yeah, thank you. Yeah, I have a friend with a mess, too. And his symptoms are less severe than mine, but he’s on the strongest, the newest medication, and he still has symptoms. And I told him about everything that I’ve done. And I was like, you gotta try this. Right? So we’ll see. Yeah, yeah. Amazing.
Dr. Andrew Wells: Dr. Manning is like a man on a mission. I know, he, he’s a great connector of people. And so, and he was really anxious to tell this story for obvious reasons. Dr. Manning, I gotta imagine that you were pretty surprised by these results as well. What, what, what change has this made for you?
Dr. Ryan Manning: You know, it just strengthens my faith and the laser. And you know, that it works, just put the laser on people and it works. And, you know, from what I’m, what I’m seeing, and this is my gut, and not to insult any other doctors, any other practitioners. What I’ve seen and just my gut is that people under treat, they under treat with the time they’re afraid of the hormesis. I don’t know what that word is. I mean, I know what it is, but I’ve never seen it ever. I’ve never seen it ever, I’ve never been able to achieve over treating people and seeing a negative result. So I think that, you know, doctors just essentially under treat. And so if you’re not getting the results, you know, treat longer and you’re not to hurt people. You know, the one thing that I do want to say which is so incredible about Denise’s stories, you know, he happened to tell me, you know, he was looking up, you know, the bloggers that are, you know, kind of that have the biggest audience to see. Not necessarily what they’re doing. But at one point where Denise goes, I’m not looking for a cure, I’m looking for a place I could go die, a place that I could, you know, kill myself and I hope that’s not putting you on the spot Denise, with that, hopefully that can be edited out if you take offense to it. But it’s something to be said, you know that there is hope for people you just have to find it and you also have to have faith and the light responds accordingly. And it doesn’t matter. I love the thought process that it does matter the settings, but it doesn’t matter. Just kept the laser on people go with your gut, and really start just listening, listen to the light, listen to the voice that’s telling you to push here, pull there, you know, use the lasers here. And the body will will respond, because I mean, I am getting these kinds of results with other things too, not treating diseases, just treating the body and just treating the immune system and going with the basic protocols, but you know, extended protocols, and maybe a doctor doesn’t have a time to sit there for, you know, a half hour and laser somebody themselves, but maybe, you know, your staff does, and you just charge accordingly. You know, what would a half hour take and just charge people if you’re not getting the results go longer, and especially get more lasers, I started off with the acceleration, that thing completely changed my life, just that one. And thank God for penny that she actually convinced me to get one, because that completely changed my practice. Because it’s so much easier to get results to adjust people just with the acceleration. If people get that one, they’ll never look back, then I got the VRL, which is red and purple instead of the accelerate, which is just to read. And that one tripled the effect of just the acceleration. And but we’ll stand back when I got that GVL it was like I never had lasers to me, adding that one tripled or quadrupled the effect of the other two. And that’s where the miracles like deniers have come in. And it’s just because we got sufficient light on him. And that also is a testament to him how his body responded that he never drank and never, you know, didn’t smoke, didn’t do drugs, just all of the tissue responded accordingly to the faith and light that he put into it prior to having this diagnosis. But I’ve never heard of anything like this happening ever. I’ve never, ever heard of anybody going into full remission from having Ms. And this is I’m sure it has before but this is certainly a way the lasers the cryo therapy and, and faith putting faith into it. Yeah.
Dr. Chad Woolner: I want to highlight something you mentioned, Brian, that I think is going to be important for listeners moving forward as we hear more of these miracle Monday stories to focus on, you know, it can get real tempting to pray, perhaps, over sensationalized and or specifically pigeonhole we want to hear things, Nate, I think naturally, lasers cure XYZ, you know, and the claims that are being thrown out. And I think the important thing that you highlighted that I just want to reiterate is, there’s no claims that are being made other than what happened, you know, and what happened happened, we know that because you’re here sharing that Denise is here sharing that. But the only claim that’s really being made is that we use these lasers to help the body do what the body needs to be able to do. And what happened, you know, and so that’s the whole point is that in terms of any sort of claims, we’re not claiming lasers now cure XYZ beyond the legal scope of what FDA clearances allow us to make claims on. But I think that’s for us in these miracle monies. That’s not the point. The point is, is that clearly, it’s been a miraculous experience. It’s been really, really cool, and hopefully inspiring, and hopefully eye-opening for people. What the human body is capable of doing when we give it the resources that it needs. So just wanted to point that out. So awesome. Denise, thank you so much for being here with us, Dr. Ryan, again, always a pleasure whenever we get to connect with you, my friend. And thanks for being willing to share this story with us, Denise, we really appreciate it. And again, we’re super glad that you’re doing better. Great to hear. Andrew, any final thoughts?
Dr. Andrew Wells: No, just want to echo what Chad is saying, Denise? Yeah. First and foremost, thank you to you for sharing your story. No doubt this is going to impact other people and we’re happy for where you are and happy you connected with Dr. Ryan and Dr. Ryan. Thanks again for being an awesome connector. You always have amazing stories to share with us and good people for our audience to connect with. So thank you for facilitating this and yeah, hopefully we’ll have some more really cool stories like this to share. And for the listeners. Thanks for tuning in and listening to this and hopefully this has been inspiring for you. And also, you know, a good learning experience for potential patients that are maybe suffering with similar.
Dr. Ryan Manning: So one last thing, if you don’t mind, what will be really amazing, we got to do a follow-up session because in September, he’s doing another MRI. And I’m getting the FX. I believe this at the end of this week, the 405, the beginning of next week, which Denise is going to be under more than the times that he said he wanted to come? Because we’re going to see what happens to that brain? And if that actually heals the lesions, that will be one hell of a case study.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Boy, will it ever. Absolutely. Well, we’ll make sure to do a follow-up for sure. So, thanks again and everybody. We hope that this has been an inspiring episode for you. We appreciate you tuning in. We’ll talk to y’all later. Have an amazing day. Thanks for listening to the laser light show. Be sure to subscribe and give us a ring.
Dr. Ryan Manning, a chiropractor based in California with a strengthened faith in laser based therapy, brings his patient Denise Yakovenko, suffering with MS, to discuss the impact of Low-Level Laser therapy. Advocating for extended laser treatment protocols and the use of multiple lasers for enhanced effectiveness, together Dr. Manning Denise Yakovenko showcases the potential for positive outcomes in treating the body and immune system.
On today’s episode of the Laser Light Show Dr. Ryan Manning and one of his patients share an incredible story of healing and recovery after using the Zerona Z6 and GVL lasers. This was POWERFUL to hear! His patient had been an avid runner and after suffering a devastating diagnosis, went to Dr. Manning and experienced something pretty remarkable.
Denise Yakovenko, suffering with MS, turned to Dr. Manning to minimize the symptoms. With the power of Zerona Z6 and GVL lasers, Denise was able to recover back to his old self.
“There is hope for people, you just have to find it and you also have to have faith and the light responds accordingly.” -Dr. Ryan Manning
“I think I have like 15, 16 lesions in my brain and seven and up. They stopped counting… to this day, I have zero symptoms…my doctor said that I might never get the feeling back in my feet, my legs or my hands… And I’m now back to normal, healthier than ever..” -Denise Yakovenko
“Denise is also an avid runner…So I said, let me know when you get two miles. So I think it was a week later I texted him I’m like, Denise, did you get your two miles? He goes no, but I just did a four mile hike with 1000 feet of elevation basically… And this isn’t two weeks, two and a half weeks…And he’s literally back.” -Dr. Ryan Manning
Dr. Chad Woolner: All right. Welcome to the podcast, everybody. I’m Dr. Chad Woolner here along with my good friend, Dr. Andrew Wells. On today’s episode of the laser light show, we have a special guest, Dr. Joseph Schneider. We’re really excited to chat with him. He’s an incredible physician who has been helping a lot of patients and doing many amazing things. So we’re excited to dig in and have this conversation with him. Let’s get started.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Growing up in Portland, Oregon, I used to love going to laser light shows at the Oregon Museum of Science and Industry. They would put on these amazing light shows with incredible designs synced up to some of my favorite music from the Beatles to Pink Floyd, Jimi Hendrix, and Metallica. They were awesome. Little did I know then that lasers would have such a profound effect on my life decades later. As a chiropractic physician, I have seen firsthand just how powerful laser therapy is in helping patients struggling with a wide range of health problems. As the leader in laser therapy, Erchonia has pioneered the field, obtaining 20 of the 23 total FDA clearances for therapeutic application of lasers. On this podcast, we’ll explore the science and technology and physiology behind what makes these tools so powerful. Join me as we explore low-level laser therapy. I’m Dr. Chad Woolner, along with my good friend, Dr. Andrew Wells, and welcome to the laser light show. All right, everybody. Welcome to the show. And welcome to the show, Dr. Schneider. We’re so excited to have you here with us.
Dr. Joseph Schneider: I really appreciate being with such great practitioners and coaches. And you guys have been a real inspiration for me, seeing the kind of work that you do.
Dr. Chad Woolner: We appreciate that. Yeah, we’re excited to have you here on the show with us. Yeah, so tell us a little bit about yourself, kind of what you’re doing. I know you’re a functional neurologist. You’ve had decades of experience hands-on in the trenches in a wide range of different areas of brain health, working with kids and adults and everything in between. So, yeah, tell us a little bit about your career and what you’ve been up to.
Dr. Joseph Schneider: Well, my career really started early on. At seven, my father passed away from a stroke as a result of uncontrolled diabetes. So my mother, who’s my hero, wanted us to eat right, exercise, you know, do all the natural things so that we wouldn’t suffer the same consequences that my father suffered. And then my aunt had cerebral palsy. She was in a violinist state school. Being the oldest brother, I had to lift her, you know, at nine years old and help her out in the wheelchair, and so forth and so on. So I really got close to brain injury at that point after my father had a stroke. And I spent my life having a great relationship with my aunt, who eventually died at 78 at a violinist state school. So I went to college for physics, and I became an engineer physicist. I made simulators for power plants. The I got back pain from being over the design board all day long designing circuits and trying to create simulators. I went to a chiropractor, Dr. Bill Oliver from Irvington, New Jersey. He was just a dynamic, wonderful doctor. I went to his Spinal Care class, and he said that the brain is the master control system of the body. At the time, I was riding horses for a Texas technical school that trained operators on master control systems for power plants. I’m like, I wouldn’t do that. I wouldn’t do that. I’m gonna do that. So I went in the next day. I told my supervisor, I’m going to chiropractic college. That’s amazing. You’re crazy. You’re nuts. You’re gonna go bankrupt. You’re gonna get poor. You’ll never catch up. It’s just gonna be horrible. Don’t do it. Don’t do it. At the time, someone said, Don’t do it. I just like, again, I’m doing it. So what was that?
Dr. Chad Woolner: What year was this?
Dr. Joseph Schneider: 1982
Dr. Chad Woolner: 1982. Wow.
Dr. Joseph Schneider: Yeah,
Dr. Andrew Wells: How far were you in your career? As an engineer when you made that decision.
Dr. Joseph Schneider: I graduated in ’79. So I was working for the company. I was a project engineer quite rapidly. Because my supervisor, an engineer supervisor at the time, had a picture-perfect memory. He just read books and he knew it. Wow. I learned from the best early on, and I didn’t want to learn from him because I wanted someone with a degree. I asked him, I said, Why didn’t you ever get your degree? Because I’ve read the book in about 20 minutes. And when I went to class, I already knew it all. So if it was a waste of my money, so I finally decided to work. That’s brilliant. I was like, Okay, I think I want to be brilliant like you, but that wasn’t in the cards. So when I went to New York chiropractic college, I met Dr. Ted Carrick, and Dr. And Apollo, Tiana was the present time and he was a wonderful Upper Cervical chiropractor. And Ted was a friend of Dr. Positano. So when I graduated, I started, and I’m right down the street from WestChester University. Ted was teaching in Westchester. In 1989, I started my studies in neurology and chiropractic. So all through the early ’90s. It wasn’t until 1995 that I sat for my delayed exam. I was board certified in neurology. But so I had a neurology slant in my practice the whole time. And then I was following Dr. Jeffrey bland pretty closely, listening to his tapes, and so forth. So I got really, really good at nutrition and neurology. Through the years, I’ve always wanted to practice that I had a hat now. It’s neurology-based. Every time I get a patient that’s in a wheelchair or can’t walk, I think about my aunt Marie, every time I get a stroke case, I think about my dad. Making an impact with humanity. Using chiropractic first is chiropractic first, neurology, functional neurology second. So we’re very chiropractic-oriented in the practice. Everybody gets adjusted. The upper cervical complex is very important to me. And the operation, not only of the upper cervical is but the brainstem itself. So we’ve developed a kind of a style. Since I was an engineer, technology is near and dear to my heart. That’s where Erchonia came in. When I do something, and I bring technology into the office, I want to know that it’s the right thing at the right amount at the right time. Kind of like, you know, DD Palmer, BJ Palmer concept, right? And then when you get the body what it needs, the right time, the right amount, then you start getting healing. So we know that, and I’m sure you know it very intimately, that our brain and our body are plastic. It really is. Health is plastic. It can be changed, it can be guided. I’m also guided by the principle that the body needs convalescence. Dr. Kerry Bone, for many herbs, which, in his book, on herbs, he talks about convalescence and how the body needs time and the right components to bring it forward to get some healing going. So when we get a sick person in the office, we don’t want to treat them segmentally. What segment, well, they have ADHD, but they have a spot on their chin, so I’m gonna give them a cream to put on their chin. Okay, well, you know, that sounds ridiculous. But it’s also ridiculous that if someone comes in, and they have a visual dysfunction, that visual dysfunction also is intimate with a vestibular dysfunction, which is also intimate with an upper cervical dysfunction. When you combine therapies properly, and you look at the overlap of the nervous system, and you go from segmented care to integrated care, then you’re checking off a list but you’re not really doing that. You’re really looking at a whole spectrum of interactions that happen in the body. Then we know that the nervous system also brings into play the autonomic nervous system. The autonomic nervous system is probably the most powerful aspect of central nervous system control in the body, which goes into the biochemical aspects of it. Also, the neuro-immunology that goes along with it. What we’re trying to do here, and what I’m saying is trying because there’s always a new learning that happens when you’re involved in it, right? I’m sure in your systems that you’ve come up with, there’s always a new learning, and then you change things a little bit more, and then you change things a little bit more. But in that process, it gets better and better. It doesn’t just get better for the business system or the efficiencies in the office. Ultimately, it’s better for the patient. Yeah, absolutely. So the next thing that happens is that chiropractic centers and functional neurology centers have to become research centers and education centers, not just doctor’s offices. Not that a doctor’s office is something marvelous and magnificent, but a Research Education Center would propel us into a modern world better. That’s kind of like my opinion.
Dr. Andrew Wells: I couldn’t agree more with your opinion. And you’ve all had, you know, we laser light show caters mainly to the chiropractic crowd. We have lots of other practitioners as well, MDS and nurse practitioners, acupuncturists. And as three chiropractors on the call here, we’ve all had conversations with Docs who had been in practice for a long time, saying, patients don’t heal as fast as they used to. Just through a chiropractic adjustment, and not to minimize an adjustment, an adjustment is incredibly powerful. If you position that kind of as the top of your heap in terms of therapies that you offer. But I think we have to agree that as chiropractors, we should be leading the conversation on how to integrate, like you mentioned, other therapies, other specialties, other services, from a research standpoint, to help drive better outcomes with patients. Because we’re, you know, as much as chiropractors are to many patients, the be-all in terms of Holistic Health, right? Most chiropractors are pretty adept at manual therapies and nutrition and exercise and, philosophically, very sound in terms of their approach. But oftentimes, we’re very mono, I don’t know the word for it. And we’re very singular in the types of modalities that we’re including, meaning. I’m a chiropractor who knows all these different tools, but I just adjust or I just and maybe provide some nutrition advice. And then you have someone like yourself, who is adjusting and incorporating functional neurology, functional medicine, nutrition, and education, all in one. I think that’s really where the profession is headed. And I think that’s becoming fashionable in chiropractic, I think and in healthcare, is to be, you know, kind of getting back to fundamental practices and incorporating lots of different modalities. You seem to have figured that out a lot faster than most practitioners, I think.
Dr. Joseph Schneider: I think you get thrown into things life throws you. As soon as God does it, God throws you into things that you didn’t expect. Yeah, you’re smiling. So I got a story behind that too. Right. Oh, for me, for me to make it to the next level for something I’ve always wanted to do my entire life. I had a stroke. And it was a reset button. And I mean, I had a God moment at that time. And so the center was impossible, really. I mean, I went a million dollars a day, I lost all my businesses, all my practices, everything. And I had a second stroke in the hospital, and I was pretty upset. peeing my pants every night was like, Okay, it’s not gonna be just not gonna happen, you know, not coming back. And doctors are telling me I basically was coming back
Dr. Chad Woolner: What year was this Dr. Schneider?
Dr. Joseph Schneider: 2017
Dr. Chad Woolner: Oh, so this was not that long ago. Wow.
Dr. Joseph Schneider: And then I got a call from my good friend Mike grew to Derya from New York. And he said, Come on to my center for two weeks and let’s get rockin ‘and rollin’ on this. And I’m like, I’m depressed. I’m on the phone. And I’m like, hey, that’s like an ad and I can’t get there by Monday. Are you kidding me? Because your comment, get your butt up here, your comments. So I did. And it was really the best decision I made. I went up to my mother, who’s 94 now. So she helped me through that two weeks. I did nine hours a day in his clinic. And after two weeks, I said, I’m coming back. And so Mike really gave me a spark type character. And also when I was in the hospital, he called me and said, you’re coming to Florida, and you’re going to do an intensive down in Florida. So when I got finished with Mike, then I went to Florida, I did intensive work. And then I went back to New York, I did for a third intensive with Mike. And then I lost everything after that. And I was like, Okay, keep going. And I set up a neuro rehab place in my mother’s house, my old bedroom. And then I did my own rehab, when I got up, go went to track every day. And I was crawling on the football field. And I was doing all kinds of stuff and swimming for a couple of hours. And I came back and then I re MRI my brain in September. And Mike would tell me autophagy Joe autophagy. Like, you know, I curse out a little bit. He’d laugh at me. And then when I wrapped my brain, I had no Skype in my brain. So I had a hemorrhage. And I’m sitting next to my neurologist, he says, This isn’t your MRI. I’m like, that’s why I get paid. Doesn’t happen. You don’t give her a scab. It just doesn’t go away. And it did. And it did because of the laser work that I did. And the neurofeedback, they did the PT and nor rehab, intravenous heart tank Oh to the whole thing. And so you get a new type of passion within your heart because it happened right. And so my family what they were saying like, Oh, well once you just have a small practice. No, no, I’m gonna get a big time. They’re not gonna happen. There’s no way it’s gonna happen. So my wife said, Okay, I’ll support you. A friend of mine gave me his office space when he wasn’t in the office. And so I was working like three days a week, adjusting patients. I got to recode in a laser, I got some harmonic vibration, I started working with that and work with patients. And then I couldn’t get a space because I’d have any money. You know, they want assets for your space. So we came to the space we have now. And she signed the lease, and didn’t ask for Financials. We put an extension in lease that we would get a bigger space here. And then a couple of months later, after the lease is signed, we’re in. She’s like, Oh, I forgot the financials. Give me your financials. Wow. And then I looked at God. I said, All right. This isn’t me. All right, keep going. Keep sending the grace. All right, keep sending it. So then COVID hit, and we in our lease, it was time to expand. So in COVID hit we got shut down. We said okay, can’t expand. It’s not gonna happen. And then it did. So then we got 600 square feet. I got a driver stem, and we’re off to the races.
Dr. Andrew Wells: First and foremost like that, I’m happy you’re back. That’s an incredible story. I think a lot of people would have thrown in the towel if they were you years ago because having been through what you’ve been through losing everything. At a certain point in life. I don’t care if you’re 30, 40, 50 years old. Having the determination that comes back from that is incredible. And here you are, you know We just mentioned Dr. Schneider before we recorded this, we recorded an episode with Vitor Belfort. For MMA fans, they know who that guy is because he’s was a legend, and he’s still at 46 years old is still boxing. And he’s got these three incredible kids are all top athletes like pretty incredible guy. And he mentioned this sort of way of of life for him, he described this, his definition of ego. And his ego stands for effort, grit and obedience. And as I’m listening to you talk Dr. Schneider, I’m looking at my notes from that episode with him just an hour ago, of effort, grit and obedience. And you’re living those three things. You think of effort, as you’re saying, like I just had two strokes. And I’m, you know, a couple of weeks ago, crawling out a week later crawling on a football field and swimming and doing the stuff that’s necessary to come back from that. The grit to know be was a million dollars in the hole, and like, I’m gonna come back from that and making the effort to do what you needed to do. It takes some honies to do that. And then lastly, obedience like your buddy, Mike, like, Hey, you’re coming to New York? No, I’m not. Yeah, you are. Okay, I’ll come to New York. And just being able to, you know, being humble enough in that, no doubt, very vulnerable space, physically and mentally, spiritually, where you were probably massive depression, I’m guessing as well, to be able to follow, you know, lead a lead of one of your colleagues and also someone like, you know, legend like Dr. Carrick, that takes a tremendous amount of obedience, and you’re at your lowest point. So as you’re as you’re telling your story, I’m like, Man, that was exactly what Vitor was talking about the year, you know, living and in the very recent, recent past as well. Incredible grief. Here you are now, I’m sure of a different mission, vision and purpose for your practice at this point, having been through what you’ve been through.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah. And, and I wanted to chime in and just say, you know, as you’re telling us your story, which first and foremost, thank you for sharing and being so transparent and vulnerable because I can’t imagine myself, I would echo exactly what Andrew said. But I wanted to point something out because we’re the practitioners and or patients who are listening to this, who can relate which everybody should be able to relate on some level and or degree, right, because life throws challenges to all of us universally. That’s one of the facts of life, the guarantees of life. But the thing that I wanted to point out for those who are listening, when we’re when we’re at the bottom, when we’re at that kind of point of like wanting to metaphorically throw in the towel, recognize that for Dr. Schneider, he didn’t just say this sucks, let’s flip the switch. It was a process, I mean, just just the abbreviated version of what you shared with us, I was mentally kind of going there. And I’m like, Man, that must have been a slow and steady SLOG and or grind, you know, because you’re not just talking about the physical and emotional side of things from the stroke itself and the rehab process. But also looming in the background, there were all of the financial implications that you shared as well. And so that had to have been incredibly frustrating, incredibly discouraging, as Andrew already pointed out, and I want practitioners who are listening to this, who may be in the midst of some trials or some struggles, financially, emotionally, physically, whatever that looks like, follow Dr. Schneider’s lead. And just take it one day at a time and keep pressing forward and slog through that process. Things do get better. Things clearly have gotten better for you, I would have no clue what is really cool for me to hear and see. I wouldn’t have said, Oh, this guy had a stroke, you know, let alone just a few years ago. I’m like, wow, I wouldn’t have guessed. You know, I don’t see any sort of that I can see from our speaking here, any sort of visible deficits or anything like that, that would seem to be apparent. And so yeah, I just think this is going to be a really important episode for practitioners and patients alike to hear. Because you’ve lived that you’ve been through that and no doubt that’s got to do wonders for your just general resiliency moving forward, like, you know, like that, that becomes a pretty potent measuring stick in terms of trials that get thrown your way now, you know, you come up with some trial, you’re like, well, at least it wasn’t two strokes and financial collapse. I can deal with, you know, pretty much anything at this point in time that life throws at you, right and so it’s inspiring I just wanted to share that.
Dr. Joseph Schneider: Well, I wouldn’t wish it on myself again. Right. Like clearly, clearly that. I’ll tell you that grit was what the psychologists at Jefferson told me, she said you have great. Yeah. And I didn’t know, I didn’t know what grit meant. So she gave me a book on grit. And I forget the author, but I have it in the back.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Is the title grit?
Dr. Joseph Schneider: Grit? Yeah.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Angela Duckworth, I believe is who wrote it?
Dr. Joseph Schneider: Yes, that’s it. Yeah. So I have the book. And so when I’m doing exercises with the patient, usually breathing exercises I put on their belly. But first, I tell them to look, I said, What does it say? I said, grit. I said, you’re here because you got grit. And you have courage, right? So that ego really resonates really big time with me, because every patient that comes in and makes the decision to come back, has grit. They have courage. It takes courage for them to come in, but also takes courage to get to the point where they’re as functionally near normal as possible. So that’s a big theme of mine. It had been before by stroke, that it takes courage to heal. Yeah. And you knew that healing, 1000s and 1000s and 1000s of people personally, and also through your coaching, and your seminars, and so forth. That everybody that enters your program, you have courage, because you’re making changes. And the theme is, I want to have better results with my patients, I want to have better outcomes, right? And sometimes we put a monetary value on that, which is, which is okay. All right. But first, you have to say, God, and then the healing process takes that courage and grit, not only to get started the process, but to follow through to the end.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah. As you’re, as you’re talking here, I can’t help but think, boy, this is going to be mandatory listening to all of our SFM members. Seriously, I’m not joking, like when I hear you say that I’m like, this is precisely the message that are practitioners and not just them. But any practitioner who genuinely wants to help serve patients and or humanity at large. You know, what I mean, which I would argue at least from my experiences in the chiropractic profession, the overwhelming majority, that’s the driving force behind why they do what they do is this desire to serve. But they need to hear that. And I don’t want to minimize either the point of what you’re talking about there, that the financial side of it is an important part too, because clearly, you need to be successful in practice financially, if you want to continue to have an impact in people’s lives. And so you shouldn’t shy away from that financial side of it, you should get compensated very well, because of the magnitude of the work that you’re doing. So, Dan, that’s important. So I’m interested to know, you know, since this is the laser light show, maybe tell us a little bit more specifically some of the things that were done pertaining to lasers in terms of your personal journey and maybe in terms of some more specifics of now in turn, how you’re using those with your patients.
Dr. Joseph Schneider: I started out with Erchonia, the FX 635. And I was in Dr. Miller’s office. I had the laser there. And so that was the first laser that I purchased from Erchonia. Then the Zerona that a the red light handhelds, the red and violet red, and violet, so I had three and then I got the f x 405. Then now I have two two tripods or two sets of three handsets. And the thing about brain injury thinking about injury, one of the number one things that happens is you have mitophagy so we talked about autophagy. Right, cleaning out, we talked about inflammation. And then the third part is mitophagy that means that the mitochondria, just not doing its job, and that’s probably one of the most important parts of the cell division. runs the cell. So laser late, especially with the work that Erchonia is doing, honors mitochondria. And it also honors the concept of our nieces, which is very, very important also. So every time someone comes in, I want to get the maximum amount of rehabilitation of mitochondria. And I want to reduce inflammation as much as possible. And that’s why I have lasers. And so For those listening, can you can you define mitophagy, right? We’ve, people have probably heard the term autophagy. Right, which is basically the body’s way of cleaning up cellular debris, right, or killing off in in a healthy way, kind of weeding or pruning, dead or dying or, you know, to put it in Napoleon Dynamite where decoded cells, right, can I use that into decoded cells? But but mitophagy can you maybe define that? Well, it’s really a pathology of the mitochondria. They’re either not working efficiently, or they’re not, they don’t have the numbers they have. So they decrease number decrease efficiency. And so the healing process needs energy. And that energy is crucial to cellular health, not only in the brain, but throughout the rest of the body. So some of the first things that a laser does, Red was cytochrome c, which is the fourth protein on the electron transport chain. And now that we have violet for one and two, we have green for four, three. I don’t know what’s happening with five yet, but we’ll see what happens with number five, but that produces more ATP or energy for the cell. And then the cell can do its own maintenance, and produce the chemicals that it needs to be healthy and thrive, and also produce chemicals for other processes outside the cell to help the whole organism function properly. Now, one of the most amazing things about brain mitochondria is that the cell can produce his own, but astrocytes actually as the brain is healthier. The astrocytes which supports the synapse actually donates mitochondria to sick neurons boosting it know that Yeah. Are you kidding me? Astrocytes are there for maintenance of the synapse, but they’re there for the maintenance of the neuron itself. So if the neuron needs it, then it’s going to give it to it. So when you start having a healthy brain, in function, and the function of the brain is really stimulation, and communication, right? So mitochondria are really important for that process. And then the processes of the brain are always plasticizing. I wake up in the morning, I have a new experience, I see something, I’m creating memories, and I’m working my body in different ways. So we’re always plasticizing. So when we have brain derived neurotrophic factors, and I think you talked about the idea of detoxification of the body, right? Well, detoxification is a natural process. It’s something that happens all the time, we’re always detoxifying her system. And so the brain with brain derived neurotrophic factors, in a healthy organism, they are always there, they’re always functioning, they’re always there to make changes to learn new experiences, get stronger in the gym, to do whatever you need to do. So that’s, you know, the kind of the beauty of our bodies and our brain that those processes need to be supported. When we have a trauma, or we have a sickness, or we have a kind of a dysfunction that happens from lifting or something like that, and our lower back. They’re there. They’re there to support us not only a normal function, but they’re more important when we have a challenge of either sickness or disease that happens with our system.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah, when you’re too poor to say that, I Sorry to interrupt the injury when you’re talking about that. I’m reminded of the book live wired by David Eagleman, if you’ve read that book, though. Fantastic. What he basically just describes in vivid detail is is the inherent plasticity of the brain in terms of exactly that like when you exactly what you do. said there, you know, you have any subtle, slight new experience with life, it changes your brain in in very real and very profound ways just showing and thus proving, you know, the dynamic nature of the way our brain was designed to be rewired in an instant, you know, moment by moment, second by second. And so it’s this very far more adaptable system than we originally thought back in the day, you know, old school, conventional thinking of the brain was, it is what it is, you got what you got, it’s this very rigid thing. But what science is now showing loud and clear for us is just how incredibly dynamic and evolving the brain and the nervous system is. So anyways, what were you gonna say, Andrew?
Dr. Andrew Wells: Yeah, I was just gonna ask the question. If we’re talking about lasers, increasing energy levels, essentially, in the cell, is it? Is it fair to say that the energy system in the cell is the rate limiting factor, or plasticity?
Dr. Joseph Schneider: Correct.
Dr. Andrew Wells: So there are a lot of things, obviously, that affect mitochondrial health and affect ATP production. So what you’re saying is that in order to get to that point where your brain can sort of relearn rewire function at full capacity, the battery essentially has to be full. And, lasers are what helps increase that battery level in the lack of a better way of putting that.
Dr. Joseph Schneider: Can I change that just a little bit? Can I do that?
Dr. Andrew Wells: Oh, please. Absolutely.
Dr. Joseph Schneider: That’s really good, right. So batteries charge. In drain, right. So the battery size needs to be big, but it needs to be resilient. Okay. And so when you did rhythm reset, right, Chad, okay. And so we have primary rhythms within our body. And it’s because we wake up and we fall asleep. And so there are systems that create wakefulness. And then there are systems that put into effect while we’re sleeping autophagy clean up where we messed up throughout the day, right. So batteries need to be resilient, they need to charge and they need to drain. And they need to do that efficiently. And so having the energy means that it’s a constant process that’s going on, and lasers make that process very resilient, I got energy, I’m willing to give it up. And then I’m willing to embrace the fact that I need to rest and recharge, and then come back in a better state. So with most of our patients, the sleep cycle, and wakefulness cycle, is is not working properly, whether they’ve had a stroke, traumatic brain injury, they’re ADHD kids that come in autistic kids, whatever, that is probably the most important part of it. And when we do autonomic evaluations, right, and we’re looking how the body responds and heart rate, oxygen. That’s the prior thing that we can test right? We’re looking at either a robic process or an animal process. So we do things like cue athlete, which tells us how the cell is structured, to process aerobically and anaerobically. And then, to really get a patient healthy. Then the final part of it is sleep wake, anaerobic and aerobic type process, right. And they all have their own parts of the rehabilitation process. So I’m really excited about getting involved with simplify functional medicine, because they’re the concepts that are kind of like the final detail that we need to clean up for patients if that if that rings true for you to.
Dr. Chad Woolner: 100%. Yeah, yeah, that totally, totally makes sense. And that’s kind of what’s interesting. You say that is that for us, we’ve been kind of lately going down this rabbit hole of looking at mitochondrial function and or dysfunction and or the necessity to instill within the body at a cellular level, sufficient energy to be able to help carry out tasks like resetting the rhythm and or neutral Shell healing and or stress resiliency training and we’re anything else that we’re doing and so it the lasers. Little did we realize because we started simplified functional medicine long before Erchonia was even on our radar, right. It was like this. You could call it coincidence. I think it’s by design something much bigger to play personally. But, but it has literally been you had mentioned, I think you said a puzzle piece at the beginning of this very much like a puzzle piece that just it was a key key pivotal puzzle piece for us. The lasers that become such more and this is not just because this is the laser light show. And we’re the host of the podcast, it’s just the truth. And that’s what lended us become the host is because we saw early on the writing on the wall of just what a pivotal piece of the overall equation. The lasers were going to obviously have been in this overall equation. And so yeah, absolutely incredible what we’ve seen and how that all fits together. I wanted to clarify something too. When we talk about this idea of mitophagy Are you suggesting that the low level lasers are assisting in the mitophagy process?
Dr. Joseph Schneider: Well know their system, they’re assisting in getting rid of mitophagy.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Oh, okay. Okay. Because if I’m, and I want to just again, I wanted to clarify when we hear of autophagy, autophagy is a good thing, right? That’s the clearing of the cellular debris. Is mitophagy not the same thing as autophagy not clearing up of dysfunctional mitochondria, or is it? What you’re saying is mitophagy is the state of dysfunction within mitochondria.
Dr. Joseph Schneider: I would use the term as the state of dysfunction.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Okay. Okay. And so
Dr. Joseph Schneider: Autophagy is a good thing, right? But usually in brain trauma, the body goes through autophagy Okay, natural process. Okay, but usually, the microglia who do like the macrophages of the body, do most of that work, and they get ramified and then the ratification process causes them to overdo, right? Right. So they kill too much and they clean up too much. Okay,
Dr. Chad Woolner: Okay. So it goes from, from healthy, clean up to okay, we’re kind of like in I mean, in broad strokes in broad strokes, we’re talking about inflammation, right? Inflammation inherently, in and of itself, is the body’s response, it should, in an ideal world, do what it needs to do. But the problem is that uncontrolled unbridled inflammation can lead to all the different negative health consequences that we see today. Right? So
Dr. Joseph Schneider: Yeah, you know, and if you look at complement, which is part of what microglia look at, and that’s the immune process of clean up in the body of pathogens, that needs to be settled down. So we use SPM a lot with that.
Dr. Chad Woolner: As PMS, can you define that? Sorry,
Dr. Joseph Schneider: They’re a derivative of omega three fatty acids, actually cool the compliment down? Okay, you kind of get the resolvers resolving the inflammation of the immune system. Okay. And so they’re very important, some of my early research on stroke. And some of the patients that have had coming in, they always had second strokes, and sometimes third strokes, right. And that’s a process called gliosis. And gliosis, is that inflammation that’s not resolving in the brain that’s causing either a vascular event again, or a hemorrhage again, or just a dying of, of new cells or neurons in the brain. So it’s very important for our work to cool down the inflammatory process so that they don’t get subsequent stroke activity or cellular death in the brain. Right?
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah. Makes sense. Absolutely incredible. Man. We could, we could talk for hours on this but Andrew, any final thoughts from you?
Dr. Andrew Wells: Yeah, as you are building up your practice here. What, what, what excites you at this point in practice? What are you looking forward to in the next few years with the work that you’re doing?
Dr. Joseph Schneider: Well, I just started my master’s with the Chiro institute in North science. So I’ll probably get that when I’m 80 or so.
Dr. Chad Woolner: It’s amazing, though.
Dr. Joseph Schneider: It’s really important that we become a Research Education Center. So we want to do clinical research case studies on patients, using the technology we have. So, primarily we had your feedback, lasers, we have gyro stem. And so we’re doing a lot of work with almost every patient with those three modalities, but we have other modalities also that we use. And so we just want to continue honing our outcomes, and trying to come down with, you know, our patient comps are gonna, like how long is gonna take, you know, can you give me better, and so forth and so on. And so we’re coming up with those systems, but I also want to create research around it. And, and work with some universities, maybe some multidisciplinary type of doctors, and other medical doctors, DEOs, physiatrist, or, you know, whatever, and really come up with better protocols for treating brain based cases.
Dr. Chad Woolner: That’s amazing.
Dr. Andrew Wells: I’m happy to hear that, because that’s such a needed thing. And one of the, one of the first things we talked about on this episode was that you use Erchonia, because it’s a research, scientific, drug structured protocol that you can use on patients who know, you know, what works based on the research, and, and quantifying the integrative approach to brain health issues, is going to be so important over the next few years and decades, because this is a massively growing epidemic, whether it’s on the developmental side, the degenerative side, UTIs, and traumatic brain injuries. It’s a massive, massive issue here, not only in the US, but worldwide. And so I’m really encouraged to know that we have somebody like you working in the trenches to develop the protocols into what they should do. Yeah, yeah, I appreciate that. Thanks. A lot. What? Lasers? Now, when we talk about mitochondria, that’s only a really small tip of the benefit solely with lasers. So when you use Zerona, the adipose cell actually opens up a pore. Now, that’s just mitochondria. Right? That’s, that’s a membrane. Right? Okay, so what’s happening with the membrane? So I’m thinking that it’s going to expand into kinases, right? Does it affect the kinase system from the membrane to the nucleus? And does it affect RNA? Does it affect processing of DNA? Does it have epigenetic effects on the cell itself, too? So I think that we’re just learning about the mitochondria, but there’s more to come.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Absolutely, yeah. No, I couldn’t agree more. And that’s what makes this so exciting, right? Is that what happens? What seems to be the common theme is just when you think you have it understood, some new discovery, you know, awakens your excitement about the potential and it just seems like that’s happening all the time here, especially in this realm with lasers so much exciting stuff happening. So it’s cool to be able to chat with people like you and hear a lot about these amazing things. So we appreciate you taking time out of your schedule to be with us on this interview. This has been phenomenal. And I’m excited to share this with fun.
Dr. Joseph Schneider: Thank you very much for having me.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Absolutely.
Dr. Andrew Wells:
So hopefully you can be a guest again soon because we want to follow your progression and in what you’re doing in your office for research. Yeah. Truly a great doctor to be following especially for our listeners.
Dr. Joseph Schneider: I really appreciate you too, so well.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Thank you.
Dr. Joseph Schneider: You’ve done a good work
Dr. Chad Woolner:
Thank you so much. Yeah, so Doc’s we hope and Doc’s and other listeners will say we hope that this has been a really wonderful episode for you to tune into and we hope that this has been beneficial. Share this with others that you think could benefit and we will talk to you guys on the next episode. Have a good one, everybody.
Dr. Joseph Schneider: Thank you very much. Take care.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Thanks for listening to the laser light show. Be sure to subscribe and give us a review. If you’re interested in learning more about Erchonia lasers, just head on over to Erchonia.com. There you’ll find a ton of useful resources including research news and links to upcoming live events, as well at Erchonia E community where you can access for free additional resources including advanced training and business tools. Again, thanks for listening and we will catch you on the next episode.
Dr. Joseph Schneider graduated in ’79 and worked as a project engineer, learning from a supervisor with a photographic memory. Despite not having a degree, the supervisor’s medicinal knowledge coupled with familial triggers led Dr. Schneider to pursue chiropractic studies with a focus on neurology, eventually becoming board certified in 1995.
Dr. Schneider began his laser journey with the Erchonia’s FX 635 laser and gradually expanded to include but not limited to the Zerona and the FX 405. They emphasize the importance of addressing mitophagy, a pathology of mitochondria that affects their efficiency and quantity. Dr. Schneider discusses how Erchonia’s lasers, by targeting specific proteins in the electron transport chain, enhance ATP production, supporting cellular maintenance and overall organism function. They highlight the role of brain mitochondria in healthy brain function, emphasizing the constant plasticity of the brain. Overall, Dr. Scheider connects this to brain-derived neurotrophic factors and underscores the importance of supporting these processes, particularly during trauma or dysfunction.
The goal is integrated care, considering the overlap of the nervous system, autonomic nervous system, and neuro-immunology. Dr. Schneider advocates for chiropractic and functional neurology centers to evolve into research and education centers for a more modern approach.
“So every time someone comes in, I want to get the maximum amount of rehabilitation of mitochondria. And I want to reduce inflammation as much as possible. And that’s why I have lasers.” -Dr. Schneider
“The autonomic nervous system is probably the most powerful aspect of central nervous system control in the body, which goes into the biochemical aspects of it. Also, the neuro-immunology that goes along with it….So the next thing that happens is that chiropractic centers and functional neurology centers have to become research centers and education centers, not just doctor’s offices.” -Dr. Schneider
“Most chiropractors are pretty adept at manual therapies and nutrition and exercise and, philosophically, very sound in terms of their approach. But oftentimes, we’re very mono, I don’t know the word for it. And we’re very singular in the types of modalities that we’re including….And then you have someone like yourself, who is adjusting and incorporating functional neurology, functional medicine, nutrition, and education, all in one. I think that’s really where the profession is headed… kind of getting back to fundamental practices and incorporating lots of different modalities.” -Dr. Andrew Wells
Dr. Chad Woolner: Welcome to Miracle Mondays, a brand new segment of the Laser Light Show focused exclusively on practitioners and patients’ amazing and sometimes even unbelievable stories that are occurring each and every day all across the country. We hope that you really enjoy these. And hopefully, you can see that miracles are occurring all around us each and every day. These are the amazing things we get to hear and now you get to hear as well. So, we hope you enjoy Miracle Mondays. What’s going on, everybody? Dr. Chad Woolner here, and welcome to another Miracle Monday. I am really excited for this one. On today’s Miracle Monday, we have Dr. Henry Zaremba. He is a board-certified functional neurologist, and he shares an amazing miracle story about a veteran Coast Guard rescue diver who sustained some really nasty injuries, particularly some pretty bad head injuries and was dealing with some really big problems. And using Erchonia lasers was among a whole suite of different tools was able to get some amazing results with them. So I’m really excited to share this with you. Dr. Zaremba is an amazing practitioner, so we’re excited for you to hear this. So enjoy the miracle.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Growing up in Portland, Oregon, I used to love going to laser light shows at the Oregon Museum of Science and Industry. They would put on these amazing light shows with incredible designs synced up to some of my favorite music from the Beatles to Pink Floyd to Jimi Hendrix and Metallica. They were awesome. Little did I know then that lasers would have such a profound effect on my life decades later. As a chiropractic physician, I have seen firsthand just how powerful laser therapy is at helping patients struggling with a wide range of health problems. As the leader in laser therapy, Erchonia has pioneered the field in obtaining 20 of the 23 total FDA clearances for therapeutic application of lasers. On this podcast, we’ll explore the science and technology and physiology behind what makes these tools so powerful. Join me as we explore low-level laser therapy. I’m Dr. Chad Woolner, along with my good friend Dr. Andrew Wells, and welcome to the Laser Light Show.
Dr. Henry Zaremba: Thanks, Dr. Woolner. Thanks, Dr. Wells. It’s such a pleasure to have been invited to participate in this podcast. I’ve been listening to the Laser Light Show for quite some time now. So it’s really cool to connect with you guys and I’m really grateful for it and excited for the opportunity. My name is Dr. Henry Zaremba I’m a board-certified chiropractic neurologist with Apex brain centers here in Asheville, North Carolina. I graduated from Palmer Chiropractic school Florida campus in 2017. I got my start working at a functional medicine clinic in Boulder doing some neuro rehab work with Dr. Ian Holloman, you can find him on TikTok now as Dr. Otto immune. But I worked there for about a year and then I ended up getting a job at revive treatment centers which was an intensive neuro Rehabilitation Center in Denver. There I had the pleasure of working with Dr. Josh flowers. Dr. Charlene go day got to learn from some really smart people there had some really good hands-on experience working with severe traumatic brain injuries, stroke patients, a number of post-concussion syndromes, so a lot of brain injury work while I was working there, also had the opportunity to work as part of an interdisciplinary team. So I worked with MDS and pressure nurse practitioners. It was a very cool experience, and yeah, it was able to, I feel like really gained a lot of clinical acumen there to revive, and closed their doors in December of 2022. And as luck would have it, Dr. Trafford was looking for someone to join Apex brain centers around the same time and ended up being a great fit. So it’s been amazing to learn from Dr. Treefort. I’m so grateful for the opportunity to work with them. And you know, be connected with the good people like you guys that Erchonia here too. So my story regarding a patient actually starts last year when Dr. Treefort went to a Erchonia seminar extravaganza, one of those big parties you guys throw down in Florida where, you know, he had the chance to network and interact with a bunch of different reps and people that were using Erchonia products we have a had an FX 635 and a Zerona laser already at the time. But he came back and like alright, we got to get a GVL so Around the time we got in our GVL unit, handheld unit, we, we had a patient come in, who was one of the classic rough and tumble types, a lot of you out in clinical practice will know what I’m talking about. He was a veteran of the Coast Guard where he was a rescue diver. And these dudes do some real extreme stuff from holding their breath for long periods of time, going in crazy conditions, diving and crazy conditions, you know, pushing their bodies to the limit, etc. So a number of different you know, near drownings, other other sorts of injuries related to that career, you know, was a motorcycle rider for most of his life had multiple severe accidents, and a few other injuries, like in part of his part of his job working with machinery, in 2017. So a few years before he came to see us in March 2023, he was working with a machine and a piece ended up falling on him. And what ended up happening was his buddies basically gave him first aid, you know, put some peroxide on his cuts. And he drove home, you know, ended up going into the emergency room the next day, and they, you know, evaluated his rib fractures and spinal fractures and all the other things he had going on, but nobody thought to scan his head or check him out for concussions or head injuries. So, you know, down the line, multiple surgeries and further head injuries later, he came to us hemiparetic On the left side, for found muscle weakness, and he also had Complex Regional Pain Syndrome CRPS, where he had huge pain sensitivity, he had the neurovascular changes to his hand and his nails. A lot of the typical findings there, but really just profound pain that was affecting his movement affecting his mood, affecting his relationship with his wife. He came to us on a number of different medications. He’s a cigarette smoker, just to try to help deal with the pain. You know, you name it, there’s all sorts of things going on here. And then the nervous system is showing us tremoring dystonia too as a result of just this long standing, head injuries, long standing pain, you know, you name it. So a lot of layers to this case. But this was one of those amazing cases where he came to us for an intensive program. At Apex brain centers, a lot of our patients are opting for more immersive types of treatment where we have them in the office for between three and five, four or five hours over the course of a day doing repetitive therapies doing brain exercises, cold laser therapies, interactive metronome neurofeedback, we got a lot of different tools in the toolbox. So we essentially just run these patients through the three different stations over and over again. And then over the course of multiple days stacking on top of each other, we can really create some great changes faster. And that works in a lot of ways to help to instill hope. And that was what happened, in this case where this patient was signed up for a five day program. And on day three, they hadn’t they had dropped their foot on the left side, they were unable to dorsiflex that, that left foot and ankle and they were picking it up and feeling a deep not only they were they moving the left ankle, but they were actually feeling a decrease in the pain. And that was on day three, day one was mostly evaluation. So really two days of treatment in using the GVL stacked with other neurologic brain based therapies. We saw some really instantaneous dramatic changes that this was a patient who wasn’t really sure it was possible. So just seeing the you know, instant tears from him and his wife. You know, I think everybody in the room could really feel just like magic in that moment. It was one of those things where it clicked. And you could see that this was someone who went from suicidal ideation, depression, you know, alcohol and cigarettes to, you know, there’s hope again, and I’m gonna get better for my family and watching this transformation with this gentleman over the ensuing three weeks because he actually was able to extend his care plan because things were working and he was feeling good about it over the next from a five day program to a 15 day three Monday to Friday weeks. And he left with a huge improvement in his mobility, not only from improved motor activity and better just recruitment in terms of frontal lobe firing down into his muscles, but also a big reduction in his pain has complex regional pain syndrome and resulting decrease in his irritability and also improvement in his cognitive function. You know, we often think of pain as just existing on its own but pain is taking away from the brain’s resources of higher cognition, executive function, emotional regulation. and these are all things that we saw start to become restored with this patient in about a 15 day program. So I feel that the results that this patient saw wouldn’t have been possible without the GVL, especially because of what the GVL did to help accelerate his progress. That’s one of the main differences I noticed immediately with this device is that when we start using it, I feel that we are seeing shifts in these tissues, and in these brain structures faster than with some of the other lasers that we had at our disposal beforehand. Not to mention the FX 635 35 as well. So yeah, cold laser was a pivotal part of this, this person’s case, and they are immensely better off for it. It was just inspiring, I got the chance to meet his daughter as well. Such a nice family and just being able to see the really profound levels of hope and gratitude that they were expressing. It’s just the type of thing that kind of gets you up in the morning and, and gets you into the practice when you know, maybe you didn’t sleep so good or you’re not in the best mood or you’ve got you know, a bunch of emails that you need to answer. So I’m just really grateful to work. Work with Dr. Treefort and am grateful for the opportunity to work at Apex here. And also, again, grateful for the opportunity to connect with you guys. Again, looking forward to hearing some of the other miracle Monday stories that you guys are able to share. And I’m looking forward to connecting with you guys further in the future. I’d love to be on further podcasts. So if you guys are ever in Nashville, please let us know. Love to love to meet you guys for a beverage sometime. And I look forward to it sometimes. So thank you so much Dr. Woolner. Dr. Wells. That’s my story. And thank you very much.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Thanks for listening to the Laser Light Show. Be sure to subscribe and give us a review. If you’re interested in learning more about Erchonia, just head on over to Erchonia.com. There you’ll find a ton of useful resources, including research news and links to upcoming live events, as well as the Erchonia E community where you can access for free additional resources, including advanced training and business tools. Again, thanks for listening, and we will catch you on the next episode.
Dr. Henry Zaremba is a board-certified chiropractic neurologist with Apex Brain Centers in Asheville, North Carolina.
Dr. Henry Zaremba, a board-certified chiropractic neurologist with Apex Brain Centers in Asheville, North Carolina, shares a compelling story treating a veteran Coast Guard rescue diver. The diver, suffering from severe injuries, including head trauma and Complex Regional Pain Syndrome (CRPS) recovered due to a mixture of the transformative impact of Erchonia’s GVL unit, coupled with other neurologic therapies, in a comprehensive treatment program.
The patient experienced remarkable improvements in mobility, pain reduction, and cognitive function over a 15-day period. Dr. Zaremba expresses gratitude for the opportunity to connect with Erchonia and highlights the accelerated progress observed with the GVL device, emphasizing its pivotal role in the patient’s recovery.
“At Apex brain centers, a lot of our patients are opting for more immersive types of treatment where we have them in the office for between three and five, four or five hours over the course of a day doing repetitive therapies doing brain exercises, cold laser therapies, interactive metronome neurofeedback, we got a lot of different tools in the toolbox. So we essentially just run these patients through the three different stations over and over again. And then over the course of multiple days stacking on top of each other, we can really create some great changes faster. And that works in a lot of ways to help to instill hope.” -Dr. Henry Zaremba
“We often think of pain as just existing on its own but pain is taking away from the brain’s resources of higher cognition, executive function, emotional regulation. and these are all things that we saw start to become restored with this patient in about a 15 day program. So I feel that the results that this patient saw wouldn’t have been possible without the GVL, especially because of what the GVL did to help accelerate his progress.” -Dr. Henry Zaremba
“I feel that we are seeing shifts in these tissues, and in these brain structures faster than with some of the other lasers that we had at our disposal beforehand. Not to mention the FX 635 35 as well. So yeah, cold laser was a pivotal part of this” -Dr. Henry Zaremba
Dr. Chad Woolner: What’s going on everybody? Dr. Chad Woolner here with Dr. Andrew Wells. And on today’s episode of the laser light show, we have with us our good friend and special guest, Dr. Kevin Flythe. We’re so excited to chat with him about how he is using lasers to help high-performance athletes. So let’s get started.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Growing up in Portland, Oregon, I used to love going to laser light shows at the Oregon Museum of Science and Industry; they would put on these amazing light shows with incredible designs synced up to some of my favorite music from the Beatles to Pink Floyd to Jimi Hendrix and Metallica. They were awesome. Little did I know then that lasers would have such a profound effect on my life decades later. As a chiropractic physician, I have seen firsthand just how powerful laser therapy is at helping patients struggling with a wide range of health problems. As the leader in laser therapy, Erchonia has pioneered the field in obtaining 20 of the 23 total FDA clearances for therapeutic application of lasers. On this podcast, we’ll explore the science and technology and physiology behind what makes these tools so powerful. Join me as we explore low-level laser therapy. I’m Dr. Chad Woolner, along with my good friend, Dr. Andrew Wells, and welcome to the laser light show. All right, welcome to the show, everybody. We are super excited we have with us today. Our good friend, Dr. Kevin Flythe, all the way from Georgia. Is that right down in Georgia.
Dr. Kevin Flythe: Yes, indeed, Marietta was right outside of Atlanta,
Dr. Chad Woolner: Marietta, Georgia. So we first met Kevin at our lab, I should say last and first-ever, not to be the last laser MBA seminar. And that was down in Phoenix. And Kevin was right there with us. We had an absolute blast getting to meet him and getting to know a little bit about some of the cool things he’s doing. So it’s great to connect with you again, my friend. We’re glad to have you here with us.
Dr. Kevin Flythe: Well, I’m glad to be here. Thank you so much for having me today. And allow me to share a bit of what I’ve experienced utilizing lasers over these many, many years. And then to hopefully enlighten and enrich some of the aspects of other physicians and other practitioners that are using them as well.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Fantastic. Yeah. Maybe for those listening, give us a quick snapshot of your story. Number one, professionally, how you got into what you’re doing. And then number two, kind of how your world got introduced in terms of incorporating and using Erchonia lasers?
Dr. Kevin Flythe: Well, I mean, first, me overall starting out undergraduate degree was in biology with a focus on biomedical engineering. So I’ve always grown up around the idea of health and wellness basically on the point because my parents were really those who are hard workers. So I’m a very humble background, but around people who always in pain. And then on the other side of it, it’s crazy now getting exposed to anatomy by having godparents that worked in the unfortunate point of mortuary business, always roam around bodies. So I’ve always been interested in anatomy and things of that nature. But growing up initially dealing with military doctors or Navy doctors. I initially started out as a Navy corpsman. And then my father passed away, and then I got out of the service, and then ended up going to college and started my college career with a focus on biomedical engineering. With the mindset of becoming a physician, as many of us as chiropractors, a lot of times say, we’re going to become medical doctors and we change paths. But that was directed by what I was used to dealing with. But after being an athlete all throughout, from junior high all the way through high school, and then when I did go to college, even playing ball, the first part of my time there and wrestling and martial arts and whatnot, the injuries that I had, and then looking at what my parents had endured with failed surgeries, I started studying the body more in detail. And then with the point of understanding energetic medicine, too. So I got exposed to it, I got certified as a physical therapy assistant, got certified as a personal trainer, started working at Duke University, and then physical therapy department and was one of the initial points of their reference as doing starting back school there. And most of the physical therapists there at Duke at that time were from the UK or either from Australia or New Zealand in places of that nature. So in those particular areas, chiropractic, physical therapy, your surgery, I mean, all aspects of medicine, they pretty much work together unlike what we have here. Interesting. So that exposed me to a lot of a lot of dynamics of how to integrate and being one who had many concussions and whatnot from football and of course martial law has been dumped on my head a few times. I suffer from migraine headaches. And one of my older fraternity brothers was a chiropractor. Chiropractic wasn’t even on my radar. I didn’t understand it. But I started learning McKenzie technique, which is, you know, basically long axis manipulation from one of my primary advisors when we started the back school layer, dude. So I chose the IDs, and chiropractic would be the way that I would go because chiropractic is what took my migraine headaches away. And from that point, I became a better athlete; I was able to function I’m able to think better. So I was like, this is definitely the route that I would take. So I ended up here in Atlanta, Georgia, and Life University at that time Life College, which is I’m old, William, so old school and 20 plus years of practicing. So that has been my start. What took me from there over time, upon graduation, I was always interested, and I was one of the senior assistants in the actual clinic. So I was able to adjust a bit more without clinic doctors because I could become proficient in techniques. But I knew there was more. So I got really further along into kinesiology applied kinesiology, clinical Kinesiology. And then I also traveled to India because my godparents were from there and started studying Ayurvedic medicine. Wow. Which is more looking at energetic aspects of it. So they got into it and started working with athletes during that time because I trained professional basketball players during the offseason while I was still in school, and then also when I graduated before I got licensed, that’s what I was doing. So I started understanding mind-body and adding in the additional aspect of spirit into the point of how I wanted to practice. When I got exposed to Erchonia lasers, it was to Dr. Jeff Spencer, which is uh, is the old one that’s out there, which at that time, he was Lance Armstrong’s Doctor sounds like how can this man utilize this type of energy or this type of medicine or this type of instrument, and help this man; he’s winning the Tour de France; he’s doing all this other stuff. And then I got exposed to a couple of other doctors, Dr. Evan Milan North, who was big in applied kinesiology but he was also using the lasers. Then it became Dr. John Brimhall. All of these doctors using lasers using footbaths, using muscle testing, doing all this stuff. I was like now starting to see what real hands-on points of chiropractic is along with the point of utilizing energy. So I looked at laser as an energetic medicine, more so than anything more an energetic force that I can use to enhance every aspect of who I was touching.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Wow, what an incredible and diverse background that you have. What are you going to say Andrew?
Dr. Andrew Wells: I found that for some reason, as chiropractors, we work in energy work, but sometimes I think it’s pigeonholed into like mechanical work. And, and that was, that was the thing, you know, we talked about this quite a few times on the podcast. You know, that’s the it’s like the universal tool technique that you can use is for everybody’s energy work. And then a little bit deeper it was well what tools can you use for energy work lasers across all all all across all boards, essentially. And that’s, but I want to just kind of echo what Chad said you have a really really diverse background. I don’t know anyone who’s been through PT chiropractic, air, air, Vedic medicine, bio, biomedical engineering, like you’ve had a, you have a valuable brain sitting on your shoulders. Yeah.
Dr. Kevin Flythe: I appreciate that.
Dr. Chad Woolner: I wanted to ask you it kind of alluded to this, but let’s get a little bit more specific. What sports were you specifically doing? What martial arts were you specifically do? I’m curious to know I’m sure other people are as well.
Dr. Kevin Flythe: Actually, I played football. I wrestled. I ran track. I played baseball. And then I did judo and jujitsu, outside of my wrestling. And then when I moved here, I got a bit more into jujitsu and then started Wing Chun kung fu. Wow. So now and now I’ve realized as getting older, being tossed around isn’t quite as much fun. So now I’m getting more into Tai Chi and more Qigong type work focusing on energetic internal healing. So the next time
Dr. Chad Woolner: I’m starting to notice a parallel path in terms of your eclectic background in sports, matches and dovetails pretty well with your background in medicine, no doubt. So it’s, it’s again, diverse as well. I’m going to take a quick personal moment to take a proud dad brag moment my son Sam just finished. He qualified for state for track here in Idaho. Just finished last week, in fact, placed fourth in the 100 He he broke the school was record for fastest 100. At his high school. He finished the 100 at 10.86 was his fastest time that was his PR. And to put it in perspective, the kid who took first in state was at a four-day school my son’s at a five high school this kid is in Burley Idaho you can look him up, he is the number one. nationally ranked sprinter in the 100. Right now at this time, his name is Gatling Baird, he blew everybody out it was it was a sight to behold, he blew everyone out of the water, he got a 10.15 in the 100. And so to put it in perspective, the next the next fastest kid was 10.7. So the 10.7 was the next fastest and then my son to put it in perspective, he placed fourth for the 5A 10.86 was where he was at. And just for those who I didn’t know this until like my son was involved in it, like, you start getting sub 11 in in track for the 100 You’re you’re getting crazy fast, like and so it’s joining, I was super proud of my son, he placed fourth for the 105th for the four by 200. And then six or the the 200 meter. And so it was cool. But But yes, so in terms of using these lasers with athletes, you’ve had the opportunity to work with, you know, obviously, middle school, high school, college and pro athletes tell us a little bit about maybe some of the ways in which you’re using these lasers, what you’re seeing how you’re helping maybe even some of the protocols for the docs, who are who are listening who are clamoring, wanting to know how they can get better results with high-performance athletes.
Dr. Kevin Flythe: Well, one of the best parts about it. And it’s crazy enough, even not directly in my back door, but close to me. One of my classmates is one of the teachers for Erchonia. Dr. Jerome Maruka, Jerome and I actually went to school together. So he and I have both have always been on the point of lifting and sports and athletics. So we pretty much don’t talk very often. And whenever we do, it’s like a solid brotherly workshop connection, energetic mindset. So the way that we look at athletes, the way we talk about it, especially if the younger we can get them, the more advanced and more dynamic, they’ll become the majority of the kids that I work with. And if I catch them at an early phase, utilizing laser, the adjustments, and then also what I call my body spirit connection work during the energetic medicine, because a lot of times these kids have to find themselves. The lasers help enhance it. Because the thing is, naturally when we start talking about frequency, I use sound I use color lenses along with the lasers, and then nutrition, and then to a lot of positive affirmation work. So when I tell them a lot of times utilizing laser, all I’m doing is driving and into you with at speed of light. You know, and that’s the main part about it. And now we’ve gotten to a point of utilizing the violet laser violet laser, we know what Erchonia It talks about an opponent of it with you know, Alta, antiviral, antifungal, and all the other things, it’s great, but at that particular nanometer of that point, that also exposes all the deep emotions of a person. So I can find where there’s weakness in the body. And then to we can bring it to the forefront. You know what the red, we’re going to upregulate downregulate. But now that I’ve gotten that green, it’s turned up the volume a whole nother level. And then as we learn and as we talked about there, and Phoenix when we’re stacking these things, which that gave me a whole new point, I’ve got the four or five here, the 635. I mean, I use mol Yeah, and it’s amazing working with these kids. But the main part about it, even my professional athletes, like I had a boxer in yesterday. Unfortunately, his last fight, it got pretty good. And it gave him a concussion, a real bad concussion. So I had to reset his brain, I mean, everything I do is in motion. Because the body is in motion, the brain has to correspond with the motion. So and then to whatever sport or athletic if there’s a golfer, I’m putting a golf club in his hand, and I’m laser laser in his brain laser in his body. If it’s a boxer, we put gloves on and put mitts and I put them on vibration plates do everything that I can to bring as much information to their brain as I can. If we have concussions on the other hand, and the thing is we start out slow and we start working on finding the most intricate parts of the brain so we can end up finding out where the weakness is like I had a kid and the other day when we do the countdown from 100 to one when looking at left brain activity, it can make it to 98 without full blown totally weak, so we had to find out whether weakness was so that laser has advanced so much of the points of recovery while on your normal type of deals. When they go in for a concussion test or any custom concussion protocol. They tell these kids lay down, relax, chill out, don’t move. Don’t do it. That’s that’s totally contradictory to anything. What should we do?
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah,
Dr. Kevin Flythe: You know, so It’s been major in that point and like you’re talking about your son. I mean, I have kids that come in as far as a point for football, for example, that we’re running a 454 640. By the time I get them on a viaplay, start finding out where it is find out what’s offset in that nervous system. And then we come back, adjust, really laser, getting back on a vibration play, haven’t go through particular motions, the majority of my kids within appointment within 30 days, if not less, I have them running for 344 on the easing, cutting that time majorly. And then we do affirmation work. So as they’re going through the affirmations, I’m laser in their brain, I find it out in point are you depressed? Is that something that is pointed to allowing your left brain to supersede or be overthinking over analyzing, so I kind of take the laser protocols a little bit higher, a little bit different, which I’m pretty sure I’m going to spend time with Dr. Dr. Berry at the Chicago seminars. And so I’m actually gonna pick his brain, because I know that he does some of the same stuff, you know, that I do, but higher level. So our goal is the mindset of balancing that gut and you know, with Dr. Silverman, you know, going over that gut when you guys were exposing this Arona that’s the only one I don’t have any office, but I’ve got this, I got the 635 Well, I’ll take another laser, I’m over that gut, clarifying endpoint of cleaning and gut brain axis, you know, because a lot of these athletes will come across now have ADD ADHD. Yeah. And a lot of times it’s associated with their diet. So changing a lot of that to, you know, an endpoint. So I explained to them, when we put this light on, you were also firing off in water molecules, your brain is mostly water and fat. Until we hit that gut, if you’re not hydrated correctly, we don’t have the proper minerals. And the thing is we can’t get the electrical impulses, we need to go to the rest of it aspects of the body. So it’s wide based, you know, as we had discussed and talked about, I was abandoned Holyfield’s doctor. And throughout his years and before he finally retired was the thing is, is that I brought laser. That was when my time I had my peel five. Nicely, I borrowed a peel three, when I first started working with him, and then bought a peel five, and then started working with a bear and totally changed his order. Because a lot of the points of old concussions, old injuries, I had to go through a lot of form applied kinesiology, injury recall. So it wasn’t until we started peeling the layers, and utilizing laser with that, that we got the progress that we had, in fact, the first year that I worked with him, I I didn’t charge him anything. Some other doctors watch me at a seminar doing some work. And they were like we want you to come to work with and that whole motion then was doing the foot baths was clearing and cleansing his liver. But when I brought the laser into it, even lasering in the water while he was in the foot bath made a world of difference. Wow, by detoxifying his body. But the biggest portion of that I told him, I don’t want to charge you until we get a strap back around your waist, meaning that belt, and I have pictures on my wall in the office of him getting that me holding the belt. And then from there after. Until he retired. I was the one the fourth man in the corner and carrying the belt into the ring.
Dr. Chad Woolner: That’s amazing. So cool. A couple of thoughts that I wanted to kind of circle back to, you mentioned there. Number one, I love what you’ve shared here. I think a lot of Docs and a lot of patients are going to really appreciate what you’ve shared here because it’s incredible. There’s just a wealth of information there. But I was gonna say You know, it’s interesting because for those who are listening who may not be aware, the most current up-to-date literature somewhat contradicts some of the conventional wisdom in terms of management of concussions. Old school concussion management was very much this, you need to wait, you need to rest, you need to give yourself plenty of time off and not put any sort of what they would consider, quote unquote, stress on the brain. And it sounds to me very similar to what old school thinking regarding sprain Strain Injuries was, right? You got to bed rest, bed rest, bed rest is the answer. What the most current literature seems to be indicating. And it’s funny because I just came across a couple of studies yesterday doing some research. Showing the exact opposite is true is that the brain can tolerate so long as it’s being monitored or monitored appropriately. Relatively immediate input right in the form of various activity movement-based exercise-based activities. And again, you couple that with things like low-level laser, that’s going to dramatically help ensure that you’re not overstressing or overstimulating or overloading the brain after a concussion injury but definitely, for those who have heard that after a concussion you need to kind of watch and wait it out for a week, two weeks. however long, that’s not what the most current literature is suggesting, as you kind of had indicated already and what you’re doing, clearly you’re getting. And that kind of ties into the other point that I was going to say is that the thing that I really like, and I hope people are cluing into, is that when you look at not only what you’re doing, but also what Dr. Berry does, and a lot of these other really high-level brilliant practitioners are doing is the therapies that they’re prescribing and using and doing with their patients are highly functional, highly. I’m just going to use the term pragmatic, right? You said, for instance, if somebody’s a boxer, you’re going to put boxing gloves on them while you’re doing therapy. That might seem a little strange to someone. But I think the thing is that makes that should make tons of sense is what you’re trying to do is mimic as best you can real-world scenarios so that the therapy becomes applicable to as applicable or as close to real life for that individual as possible. Right. So maybe speak to that too, a little bit unless, Andrew, was there other points that you wanted to bring up too.
Dr. Andrew Wells: Yeah, that was a question. I have one of their one of their questions for you. But yeah, maybe start with Chad’s question?
Dr. Kevin Flythe: Well, as you as you just stated, that’s what I want to do. The majority of the time, I mean, even an idea of track athletes. I mean, I have them go through the point of here in the office, I have enough of what I call my landing strip. And I pointed I have patients in the office sit in chairs, and I’m like, Why do you have this kid going through here doing a step by step, you know, like he’s on the track drill. And I was like, because I need his brain to fire off and calculate, but you walk them behind him with this light on his brain and you got another one on his lower back? What are you doing, that not only makes other patients aware of what I’m doing, but it also sees the dynamic, and then I’ll put him on our video. And sometimes I’ll even show him I said, Watch the lag in his movement. When we go down, I said, but when I come back, watch how his step picks up, the brain catches up because the aspect of utilizing the laser and the frequency, we own the cerebellum. And we know the majority of that information balance and coordination is gonna come on to that cerebellum. I said, I’m having him breathe, you will hear me breathe with your Hemi count with them. So I’m counting steps doing everything. So I’m putting input into the brain as he’s receiving it and the body is giving me that information back. So I can have not only a diagnostic measure, by the vision of seeing the movement, but we have a productive point at that time to to see what this is doing. The body is catching up. Our body is so dynamic. But you know, the thing is, most people only look at where dysfunction is. I want to find the function. So I calculate things from weakness first and build up the strength while most other practitioners and other disciplines look for strength. And they measured against the weakness. If we if we do like one of the prime examples, when I used to train some of the NBA athletes, Shaquille O’Neal was a prime example. from team to team that he went to he had injury after injury after injury. It wasn’t until he went out west and went to like the Phoenix Suns and went into the point of the Lakers and other points, they started training him from his weakness, not his strength. So when you find the weakness is like a house with an uneven foundation, you know, we utilize that in chiropractic talking about the point of balance the body all the time. But the same thing goes along with the point of utilizing the laser utilizing the technology we have. It’s about the point about find out where it’s weak, let’s build up that weakness and get it close to the strength. And then once we do that, and then we want a more even playing field. Otherwise, you go put somebody out there, then they’re going to get re injured after time after time after time. And then to the memory of pain from an injury, we have to eradicate that otherwise they’re going to be running scared playing scared, boxing, scared, whatever. So we have to erase that from the brain. So there’s other techniques that I utilize, which is quantum neurology. That will come into play and we go through a race protocol. So I’ll get literally on an open wound sometimes in here and tap all along and extremity while I’m lasering and tell him Does it hurt Does it hurt it long as they look at it and see it and I’ll have him sit up and look at it as I’m doing it because my first instinct is with the sympathetic nervous system being in that fight or flight mode. We have to get that to calm down so parasympathetic module is kicking in so we can calm their system down first. Because only at that point is the body’s going to heal. And we’re still running on fight or flight because the pain we felt initially that wound that sprain strain or any of that never get back to where it supposed to be that bring all of that to the forefront. It’s like a big screen like if you’re if you’re a trader it was that you never seen one trade stocks one screen in front of they got multiple screens when they want to make money. So I’d like to tell them I want to cash in today we will have to get assets. We don’t want to focus on the liability we have to bring up your assets. So that’s kind of the dialogue that I use in the office. So I’m utilizing the laser so we can bring it on. So like you said, putting on boxing gloves, I want you to put it on because thing is you got punched in the face. Next time you put gloves on your first instinct is going to be fight or flight as soon as you put the gloves on, and she’s like I’m about to get knocked out again, if I’m out here, and I’m gonna be playing tennis, and I sprained my ankle, and the thing is, when you move on a vibration plane, I want you to put that tennis racket in your hand, I want you to feel what it is that you got your grip because if you spray that left ankle and your right hand tennis player, your grip, the analogous point of it is the sense of it, your right hand is going to transfer that same motion, it’s coming across to your left foot. So I want motion and action, everything cross patterns, everything, I tried to put it all in there. So that way, when we’re bringing forth the laser, and we’re bringing forth movement, I need everything and be like the best calculation we can. And the points going forward. Yeah, obviously.
Dr. Andrew Wells: Dr. Kevin, you’ve been a lifelong learner. And if doctors are listening to this podcast and like, Man, how did he accumulate, learn apply these protocols? Where are some of the places that you go to learn these things like certification programs, lectures? Who do you follow? We’re like, Who are you studying right now? Where are you? Where are you? Where’s your academic focus?
Dr. Kevin Flythe: Well, I have my academic focus, which I got a little juice, I guess being out with you guys. In Phoenix, I was actually the cat watching Dr. Berry when you guys had done some other work with him, with David Kirkpatrick. Looking, watching, watching him with her and watching some of the other ideas that he has. I know, he’s a brilliant guy. And probably hard to grasp a lot of information. But my mindset has always been if you’re the best of the best. And you’re doing something that I am interested in, I love the thing is I want to learn from you. And then the bottom line at the end of that, normally, when we meet, then we end up learning from one another. So it should always be a constant exchange, like, you know, like I named Dr. Brimhall. I mean, hardly anybody hears a lot about Brimhall anymore because he doesn’t show a lot. But guys had been in practice for a long time, because especially in Arizona, he was in Mesa flat forever, and everybody was playing for the miracles. Now he’s in Colorado. So you look at that Dr. Malana, which I mean was big time with the Kansas City Chiefs way back in a way. You know, those guys and the doc Dr. Spencer, so I look at those who are really progressing and the things that I’m interested in. And that’s what I would tell any practice, we can never learn it all. But if your niche is your niche, meaning your interest is what it is, I love sports and athletics. I mean, when I worked in physical therapy, one of the biggest things I enjoyed was training. Patients who have prosthetic limbs, was one of the biggest things once they get into getting their gait back together, getting their confidence in utilizing a prosthetic limb. And fortunately, right next door to the outpatient physical therapy, there was the process, they will actually build and create the prosthesis. I would actually go over sometimes and watch and learn what they were doing, because that was that biomedical kind of engineering mindset that I had. So everything I watched was based on movement. So my buddies now and even some of the surgeons I deal with because I do manipulation on anesthesia, too. And then Watch Me Move a joint and move in extremity. And I don’t have to use a lot of force. That’s because in my mind, and I adjust and do things, a lot of times my eyes closed because I rely on more on what I feel energetically and then to also what I feel with my hands because this is my tool. Sure, my brain is my brain. But my tools are my hands. So I want to feel what’s going on. That’s like, you know, you might hear a lot of people who we’ve ever had, which I’ve been fortunate enough to have a massage from a blind person, wow, is one of the best massages you will ever find. I mean, because the thing is they rely on that tactile sense. And they’ll find themselves and connect with your breathing; they’ll connect with every part of you versus a person who comes in and saying I have multiple, multiple degrees or certificates. And you know, and I hate to get spiritual, but the thing is, it says lean on each other in your understanding right? Now all the ways acknowledge him and he’ll direct your path meaning the God within. So the thing is, is that that’s what gave me your visions gave you your source of where it is what you’re choosing to do. So you tap into that source. So when you tap into that source, and the thing is, is that really the outcome is limitless. You know, and so that’s kind of how I’ve always operated.
Dr. Chad Woolner: That’s beautiful man. What a beautiful outlook, what a beautiful philosophy. And what a beautiful way to practice just in general. It looks like you’ve just done some really incredible things and no doubt many more years to come have some really incredible things So, any final thoughts? Andrew,
Dr. Andrew Wells: Thank you for doing the podcast, I just want to also thank Erchonia for letting Chad and me host this podcast because we get to interview just really amazing people. And I’m always like, I jump, we chat, I jump on these podcasts, and we never really know we don’t have scripting and plans for these, and we never really know what direction they’re gonna go in. And, and more times than not, I’m just kind of blown away and humbled by how many amazing health care providers and people like you, Dr. Kevin, who are helping people just amazing ways, and it’s just very humbling. It’s very also inspiring what you’re doing. And thank you for sharing your story on the podcast. And I hope you know I hope Doc’s and also people in the community that listen to this patients even got some good benefits from it. So thank you for what you do and for sharing this with us.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Yeah, yeah, I would simply 100% Echo exactly what Andrew just said, Dr. Kevin, we, it has been our privilege and honor to have you here with us. I can’t help but think anytime we have guests on the show, whenever they start talking and just sharing their experience and their wisdom, I get excited because I just know just how much other practitioners are going to value it and patients alike are going to value it. It makes the job that we have hosting this podcast and one so stinkin easy, because we just get to have these just really awesome fun conversations. And number two, we just know that the heavy lifting is all on the practitioners we get to interview they just get to share just all this incredible wisdom and knowledge and experience. And so I just know that it’s going to be of a tremendous amount of value, and no doubt it’s going to help change people’s lives. For those who are in the Georgia area, we’ll make sure to put a link in the show to Dr. Kevin and his contact information in clinic because no doubt, we’re gonna get listeners who are gonna be like, I want to see that guy. I’ve got a child who’s doing sports and I want to I want to get some help. So no doubt, we’ll want to connect them with you. And obviously, Erchonia lasers, there’s they have a practitioner finder, if you’re not in that area, or if you’re not having any sort of plans to travel and see Dr. Kevin, but we definitely want this to be a resource for those because obviously, the work that you’re doing can help change a lot of people’s lives. No doubt it already has. And so again, just a tremendous amount of appreciation for you and your time, Dr. Kevin, so thank you.
Dr. Kevin Flythe: Well, thank you both Dr. Andrew and Dr. Chad for having me on the podcast. I mean, I listened to it regularly when you got us on there, and I love it. Because the idea that if we don’t share with one another, then we’ll never learn. So I mean, it’s all about sharing experience sharing testimonies. The whole idea of it is I explained to a lot of doctors even that I am one of the adjunct professors here for life. And I explained to my students all the time, I don’t want you to be like me, I want you to be better than me. So the mindset of it is this, we have to grow one another and to you know, each one, teach one. So that’s the main portion of it. And I will say never allow fear to be the thing anything that stands in the way of working with anyone because that’s false evidence appearing real. So just have faith in focus and that point of focus, follow one course until you’re successful. Don’t stop. Just keep doing it. And you guys keep on and lighten up the world with the idea of this podcast because people need to know more about Erchonia need to know more about laser and just healing overall. I appreciate you for having me on the show today.
Dr. Chad Woolner: Amazing. Yes. And what a great note to end on Dr. Kevin, thank you so much. You know, my son has been entertaining the idea of Cairo school. And I’ve told them to check out life and knowing that you’re an adjunct professor down there, stick with it for a little while longer at least tell my son, if he decides to become a chiropractor, I would love to, I would love nothing more than to have you as one of his adjunct professors. No doubt all the students there are extremely lucky to have you mentoring them and to sharing your wisdom with them. So that’s awesome. We appreciate, again, not only being here with us, but also what an incredible blessing to the profession to have a mentor like you. So that’s awesome. And keep up the great work there in Georgia. And yeah, for those listening, we hope that this has been immensely valuable for you. Share this with others that you feel could benefit because we know that there’s a lot of wisdom and value in what Dr. Kevin is shared today. So thanks for listening, everybody, and we will chat with you all on the next episode. Thanks for listening to the laser light show, be sure to subscribe and give us a review. If you’re interested in learning more about Erchonia lasers just head on over to Erchonia.com. There you’ll find a ton of useful resources including research news and links to upcoming live events, as well as Erchonia E community where you can access for free additional resources including an As training and business tools again thanks for listening and we will catch you on the next episode.
Dr. Kevin Flythe began as a Navy corpsman, who soon later found an interest in biomedical engineering and aspirations of becoming a physician after experiencing injuries from athletics and observing their parents’ struggles with failed surgeries. After graduation, Dr. Flythe pursued kinesiology, applied kinesiology, clinical kinesiology, and Ayurvedic medicine in India.
Dr. Kevin Flythe’s exposure to Erchonia stemmed from Dr. Flythe’s passion for integrating the mind, body, and spirit in their practice. Driven by desire to enhance chiropractic care, Dr. Flythe has expanded into the realm of understanding energetic medicine, seeing lasers as an energetic force to benefit those they touch.
Find out how a chiropractic neurologist loses faith in traditional medicinal practices and turns towards laser treatments in treating arthritis and joint pain.
Dr. Flythe partners with Dr. Jerome Maruka, one of their classmates and Erchonia teacher, through their strong connection in lifting, sports, and athletics. Their collaborative approach involves using laser therapy, adjustments, and a unique body-spirit connection work in energetic medicine. Since then, Dr. Flythe has found it imperative to bring attention to the advanced recovery potential of laser therapy compared to traditional protocols.
“So the way that we look at athletes, the way we talk about it,..I call my body spirit connection work during the energetic medicine, because a lot of times these kids have to find themselves. The lasers help enhance it.” -Dr. Kevin Flythe
“I explained to my students all the time, I don’t want you to be like me, I want you to be better than me. So the mindset of it is this, we have to grow one another and to you know, each one, teach one. So that’s the main portion of it.” -Dr. Kevin Flythe
“But you know, the thing is, most people only look at where dysfunction is. I want to find the function. So I calculate things from weakness first and build up strength while most other practitioners and other disciplines look for strength.” – Dr. Kevin Flythe
